Is Shaolin-Do for real?

[tattooedmonk]

masters magazine
fall 2009
masters: you travelled extensively to china in order to research the orginal training what did you discover?

morio hiagaonna:"i contacted differernt chinese masterswho helped me dig to the roots of the goju ryu system.we all agreed our techniques had evolved from the chinese white crane and tiger styles"



god you guys are so pwned lmao

Where is this from??? PWND? what the **** does that mean???

[tattooedmonk]

you right it did get infuesd with native style so why would you say it came from china then?
goju ryu came fro okinawa fellas

from all the sites that I have read from they say that it was a hybrid of chinese white crane and native okinawan arts . I have found nowhere where it says online that it comes from tiger style. NOWHERE You need to state a source that we can all varify or it is an invalid post!! obviously the okinawan arts coundnt have been all that for them to use a chinese art to make up their own new one!!!

[tattooedmonk]

you right it did get infuesd with native style so why would you say it came from china then?
goju ryu came fro okinawa fellas

the art that came from okinawa is goju but the art that came from china that became goju is southern white crane

[goju]

OH MY ****IN GOD!!!!
MORIO HIGAONNA IS CONSIDERED MY MANY TO BE THE LEADING AUTHORITY OF GOJU RYU!!!! BAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

but what would he know compared to these "sites" you visited lol

[kwaichang]

Grandmaster Kanryo Higaonna (Higashionna was the original Okinawan pronounciation) was born on March 10, 1853, in Naha, the capital city of Okinawa. His father, Kanyo, worked as a merchant sailing between the small islands of Okinawa trading everyday goods. From a young age Kanryo Higaonna helped his father in this work and through the hard physical labor that was involved he developed a strong body. Kanryo Higaonna was still in his teens when his father died suddenly.

Higaonna began his martial arts training in 1867 in Monk Fist Boxing (Lohan Quan) from Aragaki Seisho. In 1870, at the age of 16, he traveled with his instructor to Fuzhou, China. Once in Fuzhou he studied the Chinese martial arts under the great Master RuRuKo (Xie Zhonh Xiang in Chinese). RuRuKo was the founder of Whooping Crane gongfu and was a student of Pan Yuba who, in turn, was a student of Lin Shixian, a master of White Crane gongfu. Higaonna also received instruction from numerous other gongfu masters including Wai Xinxian. Hiagaonna remained in China for a period of 5-13 years. In addition to studying empty hand and weapon arts, he also became accomplished in herbology and Chinese medicine, including acupuncture.

Chojun Miyagi (founder of Goju-Ryu and successor to Higaonna) said of Higaonna, "My sensei possessed incredible strength; the severity of the training he underwent in China is beyond comprehension.... Kanryo Sensei's speed and power were truly superhuman; his hands and feet moved faster than lightning". Words cannot express his real ability. We can only say that his skill was incredible, but even this fails to do him justice.

In the year 1881, he returned to Okinawa where his martial arts would become known as Naha-te though he always referred to it as chuanfa. Kanryo Higaonna taught these martial arts to the people of Okinawa and at the same time continued his own research and practice. In order to teach the youth of Okinawa he developed a teaching method that was specifically designed to develop the mind and body; to improve both physical well-being.

The first occasion on which the previously secretive art of Naha-te "opened" to society in general, occurred in October 1905, when Higaonna began teaching at the Naha Commercial High School. When teaching, Higaonna was an extremely hard task master. However, in his everyday life he was a quiet and humble man and one who was renowned for his virtuous character. He was a person who had no need or desire for worldly things. He leads a simple life that was devoted to the study and practice of martial arts.

There are many stories that relate tales of Kanryo Higaonna's life and training. The power of his legs was legendary so that often he was referred to as "Ashi no Higaonna", ("legs Higaonna") in Okinawa. His virtuous character was widely known and respected, and because of his popularity the people of Naha bestowed him with the name, Obushi Higaonna Tanmei:, a name which reflected the affection and respect they had for this great man and supreme martial artist.

Kanryo Higaonna's unparalleled skill in the martial arts aside, his great and distinguished work was in bringing the Chinese martial arts from China to Okinawa, and from there spreading these arts among the people of Okinawa.

Kanryo Higaonna is now bestowed with the title "Kensei (sacred fists) Kanryo Higaonna" a title which is eminently fitting. His name is synonymous with Okinawan martial arts and Naha-te, and his spirit is destined to live on forever as a great and valued treasure within Okinawan culture.

Kanryo Higaonna's whole life was devoted to karate. He passed away in December 1915 at the age of 63.
No where does it mention Hu Jao again Goju is FOS all the sources I have found cite this history KC

[tattooedmonk]

is the only place I have found that GoJu Ryu has tiger in it . So for now I still say it doesnt , based on the sheer fact that wiki is often times very wrong!! Name a source or another site because thaat is the only place I found it . I will keep looking though. I know you didnt know anyting about it until you recently( today) googled it

[kwaichang]

Who is Morio ??????? Is that the pizza guy in the game He cant even get the names right. KC

[tattooedmonk]

Who is Morio ??????? Is that the pizza guy in the game He cant even get the names right. KC

LMAO I looked him up he is supposed ly the leading authority on GoJu Ryu However, I have only found that he made connections with the fuzhou wushu association when discovering the roots about the system, not that there is tiger in the system.

[kwaichang]

Dragon Times: Sensei, I would like to ask you about some of the criticisms of yourself and your teacher An'ichi Miyagi. Specifically it is said that An'ichi sensei was only a child when he trained with Chojun Miyagi Sensei, that he learned only part of the system, and that his character is, shall we say, flawed.

Morio Higaonna: If it wasn't so funny this would make me very angry. It's also very ironic. People seem unwilling to accept my word that my teacher is the little known An'ichi Miyagi, but willing to accept the claims of one of my former students that his teacher was Chojun Miyagi the founder of Goju Ryu. This despite the fact that he would have been barely more than an infant when Chojun sensei died. They ignore the truth but accept the ludicrous.

The fact of the matter is very simple. When, full of nervous excitement and with the money my mother had given me clenched in my fist, I first went to the garden dojo of Chojun Miyagi sensei as a boy of sixteen, I was told by Koshin Iha, a student of Chojun Miyagi sensei, "if you want to train seriously An'ichi will teach you." He has taught me ever since; I only have the one teacher.

This explains alot I think, this speaks of Morio Higaonna KC

[Judge Pen]

look let me put it this way since you guys dont know your arsehole from your elbow about karate


why do you think all the karate styles nowarent that old lok at goju shotokan etc etc they are all around what a 100 years old?
and whys that because there are no documents or knowledge of any ancient forms or early forms of karate the mansters didnt write it down or teach it openly and thats why the styles are not around anymore
and that is why they didnt have names for anything ther ewere no uniforms etc etc
when they tried to introduce karate to japan the okinwans felt inferior to the japs because the japanese were scholary about their native arts and had precise names fo rtheir moves kata and so on and so forth
the okinawans adopted this and began using japanese names

does this help?

It's the difference between written history and oral tradition. It doesn't mean that there were not names: they still called it a punch in their language. It has been said that the eskimos had 100 different words for snow, but that's because they are snow masters and understood the fine distinctions. There are several different kinds of punches too--and they each were named in the Oikinawan dilect that was different than the Japanese terms that they have now. They just were not written down. Heck, the probably were not even taught to the Japanese in the same way because the Okinawans didn't want them to know the good stuff.

[tattooedmonk]

isn't san chien kata white crane??? Our san he chien is supposedly the same form, right??

[tattooedmonk]

Dragon Times: Sensei, I would like to ask you about some of the criticisms of yourself and your teacher An'ichi Miyagi. Specifically it is said that An'ichi sensei was only a child when he trained with Chojun Miyagi Sensei, that he learned only part of the system, and that his character is, shall we say, flawed.

Morio Higaonna: If it wasn't so funny this would make me very angry. It's also very ironic. People seem unwilling to accept my word that my teacher is the little known An'ichi Miyagi, but willing to accept the claims of one of my former students that his teacher was Chojun Miyagi the founder of Goju Ryu. This despite the fact that he would have been barely more than an infant when Chojun sensei died. They ignore the truth but accept the ludicrous.

The fact of the matter is very simple. When, full of nervous excitement and with the money my mother had given me clenched in my fist, I first went to the garden dojo of Chojun Miyagi sensei as a boy of sixteen, I was told by Koshin Iha, a student of Chojun Miyagi sensei, "if you want to train seriously An'ichi will teach you." He has taught me ever since; I only have the one teacher.

This explains alot I think, this speaks of Morio Higaonna KC

BOOM BOOM BOOM!!!those are some hard hits

[Judge Pen]

I find it interesting that a style such as goju ryu, which is very effective and well established would still have problems with verification as to origins and debate on where certain principals orginated. Also, even the most well-respected founders spoke in hyperbole when it came to their teacher's skill.

[kwaichang]

I am not sure of the origins of San He But they are similar from what I have seen. KC

[One student]

kc has nothing to teach the mere fact that he thinks because hes old means he know more automatically ruins anything he has to say
your skill speaks for you not your age

your just oldso what everybody gets there in time woopdee do

I don't know of any respected tradition that does not teach respect for the elders of society and turn to them for wisdom and experience. Are you not familiar with the title "Grandfather," such as is used in Native American culture? And is there not a similar reverential use in Asian societies? And I'm not talking about my parent's father, either. (If that's too deep for you, go watch the "Billy Jack" movies a few more times). Only an immature child writes off the wisdom of the prior generations just because you haven't seen them perform something better than you can.

NOTE: I am not calling KC, TTM, or anyone else "old." Do not though make the mistake of writing anyone off just because they are old. Heck, if they have been around longer than I have, isn't it more likely I have something to learn from them? I suspect just from reading JP, TTM, KC, BQ, GT, I would benefit from their teachings, and I don't know how old they are. But if I know both how young someone is, and read/hear much ignorance from them, it is difficult to find anything they say worth learning about.