Learning Shaolin forms but not the theory or application

[bawang]

for me, in chen taiji spear, there are 72 moves but only 24 are spear techniques. i no longer practice the extra movements

two three years ago i would never have even thought of doing that, in fact i would be quite shocked. but after reading ancient military documents with criticism of flowery practice written by war heros i idolized as a child, i did some self reflection

we have to choose the flowery tradition and the fighting tradtition. both traditions are old and legitimate.

[Northwind]

I see what you mean Bawang and agree. However unfortunately when stuck with teaching a style, my view is that I must teach what I was taught. But at the same time I emphasize the workable techniques moreso than the flowers, unless it's a couple of months before CNY - then we focus on flowers - as usually demos are for marketing and the sheep like the flowers, if you know what I mean.

[bawang]

i respect that and theres nothing wrong with that. chinese martial arts community has no strict laws enforcing anything. all i said was my opinion.
for me i understand what is important and what is not important.
letting go of flowery habits is THE hardest thing in kung fu ive done ever.

[Northwind]

Cool. We're on the same page here then.

[bawang]

if you use flowery aspects to promote urself, corrupt aspects of kung fu to advertise yourself, thats the type of students u will attract. that will lead to lots of broken dreams and disappointments.

[Northwind]

Definitely true. Finding a balance...

[Lucas]

i respect that and theres nothing wrong with that. chinese martial arts community has no strict laws enforcing anything. all i said was my opinion.
for me i understand what is important and what is not important.
letting go of flowery habits is THE hardest thing in kung fu ive done ever.

word. i went through a similar process myself. i think part of it also has to do with your long term goals. i dont plan to teach. dont really want to. so i dont really 'need' many of the additional things in my training. lion dancing, performing, things of that nature.

[Northwind]

I think that's the gist of alot these questions that crop up; what all this stuff means for you, individually. What you get out of it, what you want to get out of it, what you're doing with it etc.

[No_Know]

.?. Take what you need?

Might be like this...


Case-A
I intend to work so I don't need school so I can drop out or just not go to college or University.


Case-B
I don't need the opposite persuasion for more than momentary entertainment--I'm noit falling in Love. And I don't want kids...so I don't need to save money. Money is for spending.

Case-C
I just want these types of moves 'cause that's what they were using on TV and guys at the school/guy do training not flailing and they do good in the ring...

Case-C (later)
Doctor says I strained core muscle groups and gave me some exercises that I should use to heal and keep me from restraining these--they prep the muscles for the hard moves like I was trying to doand like rotating crops it changes the tension to keep the big moves I like useable.

The stronger these secondary and tertiary muscles are in the right directions the better my preferred moves get in flexibility and strength.

Case-C (later later)
If I throw in the doctor recommended support moves I'm practically doing the School form before I edited it.

Arisen Situation
My car broke down.

Case-B (later) I don't get with the opposite persuasion any more without my flashy stuff. I didn't have money to fix the car and was falling behind on payments because I bought stuff to impress and didn't have the financials for things I didn't see comming or that blindsided me.

Case-A (later)
I lost my job because they upgraded machinery and I didn't have exposure to that equipment like they did at the University....


No_Know

[bawang]

Bawang, the spear form doesnt just teach techniqes of spear on spear, it has techniques against other weapons (which may be useless against a spear) it has techniques from horse back (which requires moving it from one side of the horse to the other), deliberately non lethal techniques, etc etc.

hi rendahai

chen family teaches a spear form called pear flower spear with white monkey staff. 30% of the move leftover is called "wuhua" flower twirling. if it looks like flower twirling and the actual name of the move is flower twirling then i think maybe possibly there is flowery twirling in the form.

u can track change in the form by looking at the oldest training manuals.
u said never change what u r taught. thats actually what im doing.

[Northwind]

No! Are you guys saying ...

No one said any such thing. I was referring to what I prefer and emphasize.

[bawang]

people dont really want to keep tradition. people just want to believe theyre part of something old and mysterious.

[neverfold]

In Kung Fu there are many techniques that when seen in the form can be considered flowery or useless. I was taught this is sometimes done for a reason. These seemingly useless techniques are often diluted and/or used to hide secret application or emphasis. It makes sense to do this kind of trickery. When you are showing off your form and an enemy witnesses it, you don't want them to get the full story and figure out your real power so it can be blocked or used against you. Also it is done for commercial purposes. They teach you something useless but pretty now to keep the flighty and flash oriented students interested then they teach the real form and application to those long time students who care more deeply about kung fu. Meh, just my two cents :P

[bawang]

yes

thats called the southern custom. teaching ppl wrong on purpse. a very shameful practice

The middle link is a trailer for the instructional VCD you can get from PlumPub

I've recently started self teaching myself

lol

[neverfold]

Its shameful to let your enemies know how you plan to defend yourself in a conflict so they have the chance to turn it all against you and win? I agree that teaching people wrong on purpose is not right. But when you are taught that something is wrong for a reason and then explained to why it is so and then shown the secret application or technique behind it, then i don't see the issue.

Also its very shameful of you to take other posts from other topics out of context. Very rude. I have been practicing Kung Fu for 10 years from a great teacher in an excellent school. Just recently have I started self teaching myself more wushu because I am also a stage combatant.

This rudeness seems to be your way as I look through some of your past posts so i'll leave it at this.