View Poll Results: Should we adapt kung fu to the ring?

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  • Yes

    7 63.64%
  • No

    4 36.36%
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Thread: Ring Fu

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    A school that has a teacher that is well rounded already does this.
    I understand there is a lot of crappy schools out there, but if you are going to a Kung Fu school that doesn't have a san da or si yao da component, then I would say you've made a bad choice of schools.

    All good Kung Fu schools have that guts first / condition second / technique last ladder.
    I think that's an unfairly based value judgment because there are good hard core traditional schools that go in depth into their style's training methodology, but it's the same methodology from two-hundred or three-hundred years ago and that doesn't take into account how people train and fight today. Yes we're getting into a rules component and a sport environment, but that's today's environment and where you'll most likely end up displaying your skills. So why go it alone when there is a perfectly valid distinctly Chinese training methodology which works in a sporting environment?

  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    But it doesn't have controlled environments for weapon fighting,,,because it just doesn't. Maybe we'll see some rubber-chuk fighting the future, but I for one would not pay to watch that. lol
    You've never seen competitive weapons sparring? It exists. My Sifu's tournament used to have it when he held his annual tourney and it was quite a lot of fun. Two categories existed, short weapons and long weapons. There was no mix of short vs long or dual weapon wielding. The weapons were heavy pvc wrapped in foam. competitors wore full kendo type padding. And it was a blast. I got popped with a straight spear thrust to the face plate by a different school's sifu's brother and I saw stars for a second. It was payback because I popped him first. Points were called for kill shots and all matches consisted of 3 points to win. I have some footage on VHS somewhere that I'll have to look up.

  3. #33
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    I've seen Baji spear/pole fighting. But not here. I've seen vid from China only in that regard. Looks interesting.

    I don't think I'd go for foam bat fighting. It's...not the same.

    Fencing? Yeah, that is an awesome skill to get into you, although, if you take olympic training it's about setting off the vest sensor more than really getting into the art of the sword.

    For other stick fighting there is Arnis. I used to get some of this action back when I lived in the Peg. We were lucky to have a huge population influx of people from the Filippines and Escrima, Arnis schools were popping up everywhere. Cool stuff.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    I don't think I'd go for foam bat fighting. It's...not the same.
    we built our own - took a heavy gauge PVC and wrapped it with a combination of foam and duct tape. Much better and more realistic than the premade foam stuff you can buy. The long weapons were a little more flexible than their white wax wood counter parts yet they were still stiff enough to use any spear or staff technique.

  5. #35
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    Some of us have actually done full contact stick fighting and wooden weapons fighting.
    and while there are no competitive venues for them per say ( kendo and fencing are different things), one is free to compete full contact in ANYTHING that one can get a partner for.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    we built our own - took a heavy gauge PVC and wrapped it with a combination of foam and duct tape. Much better and more realistic than the premade foam stuff you can buy. The long weapons were a little more flexible than their white wax wood counter parts yet they were still stiff enough to use any spear or staff technique.
    sounds like baji pole fighting.

    how long were the batons?
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Some of us have actually done full contact stick fighting and wooden weapons fighting.
    and while there are no competitive venues for them per say ( kendo and fencing are different things), one is free to compete full contact in ANYTHING that one can get a partner for.
    I'm going to have to go and find the footage. Even though we wore helmets and the weapons were "safe", you could hear the kill shot hits in the stands. Like I said, I saw stars when I got hit with a spear thrust to the face plate. I think that it would've been possible to knock someone out with a good spear thrust. Short weapons - sword length was more challenging for me, I just wasn't that good at it, but I did pretty good spear vs spear.

  8. #38
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    San Da is not the end-all be-all. You can kick ass with it, but it has limitations.

    The idea is to adopt the training METHODS of modern combat sports. You don't have to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Unless, of course...

    He most honors my style who learns under it to destroy the teacher. -- Walt Whitman

    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    As a mod, I don't have to explain myself to you.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    sounds like baji pole fighting.

    how long were the batons?
    six foot in length on the "spears". Not sure on the short weapons "swords".

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by MasterKiller View Post
    San Da is not the end-all be-all. You can kick ass with it, but it has limitations.

    The idea is to adopt the training METHODS of modern combat sports. You don't have to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Unless, of course...

    True - but I can't think of a better way to eliminate the bad kick boxing that happens in hard sparring. Maybe other people don't have the problem.
    ----

    My personal feeling is that if people are going to kick box anyway, they should at least look like they know what they're doing.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    True - but I can't think of a better way to eliminate the bad kick boxing that happens in hard sparring. Maybe other people don't have the problem.
    Sparring is sport. Sport fighting looks like kickboxing. If your goal is to get better at sparring, then I agree.

    Self-defense is not sport. If your goal is to survive brutal attacks, then I disagree.
    He most honors my style who learns under it to destroy the teacher. -- Walt Whitman

    Quote Originally Posted by David Jamieson View Post
    As a mod, I don't have to explain myself to you.

  12. #42
    Also the problem is during sparring sessions where you are supposed to be refining all these techniques you've been learning, most everyone resorts to the kickboxing style for various reasons:

    1. Don't trust their skills

    2. wearing gloves too big to allow for complex hand techniques

    3. Wearing slippery foot gear or no shoes which force you to be more careful than if you were just wearing shoes

    And typically the teacher has more than one match going on at a time so he can't stop someone in the middle of their match if he/she sees that a student attempted something and failed to try and show the student why they failed. So the student just thinks the technique didn't work and drops it.

    I dunno, i recently did a no gear sparring match and every time I do that I just fight better because I feel more comfortable and at ease and I'm not afraid to try techniques in that situation and I can usually get even unrefined tools to work around 60% of the time.

  13. #43
    I believe there should be a sparring element in classes, or you're missing out on a major part of training. But getting everyone to adapt their Kung fu is like converting the U.S to metric, near impossible.

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raipizo View Post
    I believe there should be a sparring element in classes, or you're missing out on a major part of training. But getting everyone to adapt their Kung fu is like converting the U.S to metric, near impossible.
    No offense...but:



    America, we need to talk ~world
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  15. #45
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    I think the reason everyone resorts to bad kick boxing is because they are forced into attacking positions that they never practice defending from.

    I mean, because of the scenario of ring combat you are forced to throw jabs and crosses and kicks in a way that is not like your kung fu, and so when the opponent counters, you have no where to go because you are unfamiliar with those techs. You do most of your practice as defense or using entries which are not possible with gloves.

    So because of the scenario you are forced into bad kick boxing because you don't know how to attack otherwise and in gloves.

    If you do the scenario thing, i.e set attacker/defender then you can concentrate on your technique.

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