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Thread: Iron palm

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by TenTigers View Post
    The increase in bone/tissue density is only one aspect of IP training.
    The idea is to develop harder and harder strikes, with less effort.
    (Of course it is relaxed. All strikes need relaxation-mass x acceleration= force. If you aren't relaxed, you will not accelerate the strike. You are driving with the parking brake on.)
    As you develop harder strikes, the hand must be made harder to be able to withstand the power of your own strikes, otherwise you are striking hard with a weak and unstable weapon. It's pure logic. No mystery, no secret.
    Projecting force into the opponent is technique. Learning to pulse your strike, and develop shock power-similar to the pulse used in CPR (the dark side of the Force of CPR:-) is part of the method.
    Sure you can call it internal..if you want.
    But I prefer to call it what it is; physics.
    Rik has *****-slapped the correct and given it the Hung Kuen wedgie of death !
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardwork108 View Post
    Any sifu who appreciates the wisdom of "downward" sandbag and sand bowl training, together with straight punching sandbag training.
    Ah, those real sifu.

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by k gledhill View Post
    Ah, those real sifu.
    Yep, there are still a few of them left.

  4. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardwork108 View Post
    Yep, there are still a few of them left.
    Can you name a few ?

  5. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by k gledhill View Post
    Can you name a few ?
    Yes, I can!

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardwork108 View Post
    Yes, I can!
    So can I. Joy's si-fu, Augustine Fong, has taught iron palm in his WC. I learned a bit of that under one of his instructors back in '79. Then I spent a dozen years with LT who felt that iron palm was a waste of time in his WT system. Experts will disagree. I can see some logic in both points of view. Most of our hitting is frontal, centerline striking, and the wall bag is good training for that. On the other hand, there is some use of downward dropping energy, as in jut-sau, gum-sau, gaun-sau and so on. Perhaps iron palm training could be used to enhance that? Or maybe you could just spend more time on the dummy.

    Personally I'd be more interested in hearing people report on what works for them and why, rather than hearing all the nitpicking and arguing between know-it-alls who are convinced that their si-fu's word is the one and only truth! I prefer to view technique and training from a benefit vs. cost perspective rather than as "right vs. wrong". Just my 2 cents.
    Last edited by Grumblegeezer; 10-20-2011 at 02:18 PM.
    "No contaban con mi astucia!" --el Chapulin Colorado

    http://www.vingtsunaz.com/
    www.nationalvt.com/

  7. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Hardwork108 View Post
    Yes, I can!
    okay, lets hear it who are they ?

  8. #23
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    Question

    Quote Originally Posted by k gledhill View Post
    okay, lets hear it who are they ?
    Kevin, are you really that obtuse, or just one of this forum's resident trolls? I gave you one example, Fong Chi Wing. Presumably, his sifu, Ho Kam Ming agreed as well. Joy could weigh in on this, as I don't really know. My old Sifu, LT did not agree. People differ on this, even within the Yip Man lineage. What makes you think that your opinion is the only correct one?
    "No contaban con mi astucia!" --el Chapulin Colorado

    http://www.vingtsunaz.com/
    www.nationalvt.com/

  9. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Grumblegeezer View Post
    Kevin, are you really that obtuse, or just one of this forum's resident trolls? I gave you one example, Fong Chi Wing. Presumably, his sifu, Ho Kam Ming agreed as well. Joy could weigh in on this, as I don't really know. My old Sifu, LT did not agree. People differ on this, even within the Yip Man lineage. What makes you think that your opinion is the only correct one?
    look in the mirror for obtuse, i wasnt asking you

  10. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Grumblegeezer View Post
    Kevin, are you really that obtuse, or just one of this forum's resident trolls? I gave you one example, Fong Chi Wing. Presumably, his sifu, Ho Kam Ming agreed as well. Joy could weigh in on this, as I don't really know. My old Sifu, LT did not agree. People differ on this, even within the Yip Man lineage. What makes you think that your opinion is the only correct one?
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Who is on first?

    Wall bags, iron palm bags are all useful if you use them correctly and well. I have used them both for years and have no arthritis in my hands. But i don't do hung gar iron palm or karate makiwara- don't need to.Iron palm and bag work enables your structure including hand structure to adjust to the impact-- naturally- if done right.
    Wing chun has a considerable curriculum- each part plays specific roles in development.

    Also you dont have to import hooking or uppercutting from boxing--wing chun body dynamics
    provides many tools.... it's a big big tool box.

    joy chaudhuri

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by k gledhill View Post
    look in the mirror for obtuse, i wasnt asking you
    Sorry Kev, my mistake. I thought you really wanted to know if anyone could "name a few" high level sifus who integrated iron palm training into their WC programs. I should have realized that you have no interest in other opinions on the topic and were just jerking people around.

    Oh, and to Joy, thanks for the input on the subject. It's nice that some folks actually use this forum to exchange information.
    "No contaban con mi astucia!" --el Chapulin Colorado

    http://www.vingtsunaz.com/
    www.nationalvt.com/

  12. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Grumblegeezer View Post
    Sorry Kev, my mistake. I thought you really wanted to know if anyone could "name a few" high level sifus who integrated iron palm training into their WC programs. I should have realized that you have no interest in other opinions on the topic and were just jerking people around.

    Oh, and to Joy, thanks for the input on the subject. It's nice that some folks actually use this forum to exchange information.
    I was and had been quoting and asking hardwork....not you, thanks

    I treat IP with obvious contempt

    well aware of AF 'plinth' striking ideas....
    Last edited by k gledhill; 10-20-2011 at 10:53 PM.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vajramusti View Post
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Who is on first?

    Wall bags, iron palm bags are all useful if you use them correctly and well. I have used them both for years and have no arthritis in my hands. But i don't do hung gar iron palm or karate makiwara- don't need to.Iron palm and bag work enables your structure including hand structure to adjust to the impact-- naturally- if done right.Wing chun has a considerable curriculum- each part plays specific roles in development.

    Also you dont have to import hooking or uppercutting from boxing--wing chun body dynamics
    provides many tools.... it's a big big tool box.

    joy chaudhuri
    This is a really good and defining point on the way WC approaches IP.

    This is one of the things you have to develop to strike correctly in WC otherwise you can't use the wrist correctly to accelerate into the target. It's also one of the reasons that training with 16oz gloves takes the sting out.

    I'd hazard a guess that it's the same with other southern short striking methods, such as with those that use the fung yao as a primary strike.

    Dave

  14. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Ozzy Dave View Post
    This is a really good and defining point on the way WC approaches IP.

    This is one of the things you have to develop to strike correctly in WC otherwise you can't use the wrist correctly to accelerate into the target. It's also one of the reasons that training with 16oz gloves takes the sting out.

    I'd hazard a guess that it's the same with other southern short striking methods, such as with those that use the fung yao as a primary strike.

    Dave
    So your saying I need Iron Palm to strike correctly for the wrist to accelerate ...?

  15. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by k gledhill View Post
    look in the mirror for obtuse, i wasnt asking you
    Yes, but he answered the question you were asking! The world is full of stuff that you don't know about authentic TCMA practice. So, the best advice for you is to do what I do, and that is keep an open and inquisitive mind and learn from those who have access to knowledge and practices that you don't.

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