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  1. #1
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    All styles, like David(s) and others pointed out, are evolving constantly, but at a pace measured in generations, perhaps only barely visible in our own lifetimes. Even a seminal figure like Bruce Lee took two generations to establish his style. And the rule is, the more generations removed from the 'seminal figure' the weaker the Fu.
    As with all study, once you have completed the regular training to the standard of your instructor, you begin to hone your skills further, and perhaps some might find a new bit to add. That being said, perhaps consistency is more relevant than purity. Purity to me indicates an un changed, un evolving constant, which may be good for academic purposes as a snapshot, but its not a living breathing thing.

    Here's the question in my mind, if you have two options, or 3 or more, in a situation, which do you choose? If you are a striker who has a little x-training to understand grappling, do you grapple or strike? Can you afford the time to think about it?

    It takes work to learn to apply a style of fighting, boxing, wrestling or Pak Mei and it becomes an issue of depth vs breadth with how many different things you learn.

    And it goes without saying that if you find holes, you fill them with whatever works for you. Its the duplication that worries me.
    Last edited by Yum Cha; 07-02-2013 at 08:01 PM.
    Guangzhou Pak Mei Kung Fu School, Sydney Australia,
    Sifu Leung, Yuk Seng
    Established 1989, Glebe Australia

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Yum Cha View Post

    All styles, like David(s) and others pointed out, are evolving constantly, but at a pace measured in generations, perhaps only barely visible in our own lifetimes. Even a seminal figure like Bruce Lee took two generations to establish his style. And the rule is, the more generations removed from the 'seminal figure' the weaker the Fu.
    While I think these are the general rules, you can always hope to challenge them... we should strive to be alive and evolving. That doesnt have to mean "disrespect" or giving up your root, but the greatest disrespect is going stale
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  3. #3
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    If I try to search for my ancient root and DNA, I may find this.

    http://imageshack.us/a/img24/8929/sc2cv.jpg
    http://imageshack.us/a/img689/8172/sc1p.jpg
    http://imageshack.us/a/img692/2203/sc4fu.jpg

    Why do I want to do that for?
    http://johnswang.com

    More opinion -> more argument
    Less opinion -> less argument
    No opinion -> no argument

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    If I try to search for my ancient root and DNA, I may find this.

    http://imageshack.us/a/img24/8929/sc2cv.jpg
    http://imageshack.us/a/img689/8172/sc1p.jpg
    http://imageshack.us/a/img692/2203/sc4fu.jpg

    Why do I want to do that for?
    I have been martial arts ever since I was a kid. I somehow I always knew things that they passed off as "tradition" were not right...

    We learn this technique, it is the third thing we learn, but we can't use it in sparring? WHY?

    Another school, there is no sparring, hah hah, this is clearly a joke, time to move on

    School tells me they don't kick, well, what if I kick?

    Lots of TCMA say they don't wrestle? Well, anyone who has ever done any sparring, much less actual fighitng, kinows there is going to be wrestling
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  5. #5
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    If I try to used this "steal a peach under leaves - groin strike" in sparring,

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys8LziWtHdE

    I would always get hit on my face. Since this is the 1st form that student has to learn in my system. I told my guys that the purpose of this move is to "bend down, grab a handfull of dirt (or sand), and then throw at your opponent's face". One of my smart ass guys asked me, "What if you stand on pavement road?" I was speechless. Why did the original form creator put this move into his form? I have no idea.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 07-02-2013 at 09:18 PM.
    http://johnswang.com

    More opinion -> more argument
    Less opinion -> less argument
    No opinion -> no argument

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    If I try to used this move in sparring,

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys8LziWtHdE

    I would always get hit on my face. Since this is the 1st form that student has to learn in my system. I told my guys that the purpose of this move is to "bend down, grab a handfull of dirt (or sand) and then throw at your opponent's face". One of my guys asked me, "What if you stand on pavement road?" I was speechless. Why did the original form creator put this move into his form? I have no idea.
    I think (hope) you are being funny.....

    right hand is striking the groin, left hand should have already moved the arm/punch aside.... or circled to trap as you turned....

    not the best technique, but it has some potential I think

    PS: I also think this is example of how to 'simplify" movement old teachers left out angles, sometimes forgetting that without the angle the technique is worthless
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkfmdc View Post
    moved the arm/punch aside....
    If that's the case, the left hand should move sideway instead of downward.
    http://johnswang.com

    More opinion -> more argument
    Less opinion -> less argument
    No opinion -> no argument

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    If I try to used this "steal a peach under leaves - groin strike" in sparring,

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ys8LziWtHdE

    I would always get hit on my face. Since this is the 1st form that student has to learn in my system. I told my guys that the purpose of this move is to "bend down, grab a handfull of dirt (or sand), and then throw at your opponent's face". One of my smart ass guys asked me, "What if you stand on pavement road?" I was speechless. Why did the original form creator put this move into his form? I have no idea.
    cuz ur doing it rong

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxQWe...ature=youtu.be

    Honorary African American
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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    Is this you? The infamous Bawang finally revealed!?!?!?!?!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkfmdc View Post
    Another school, there is no sparring, hah hah, this is clearly a joke, time to move on
    I mention this story a lot, mostly because it surprises me. I went to this school for a few months. The guy running the school learned in Taiwan from a handful of masters. He was a lineage holder and all that. He's also in the USKS hall of fame.

    Sparring? Only point sparring. Continuous sparring was a rarity, I was told. IMO, the point-sparring thing was likely for tournaments.

    Lots of TCMA say they don't wrestle? Well, anyone who has ever done any sparring, much less actual fighitng, kinows there is going to be wrestling
    No no no no no

    An invisible guy breaks up the fight and both fighters start on their feet again.
    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    like that old japanese zen monk that grabs white woman student titties to awaken them to zen, i grab titties of kung fu people to awaken them to truth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Canzonieri View Post
    You can discuss discrepancies and so on in people's posts without ripping them apart. So easy to do sitting behind a computer screen anonymously, but in person I'm sure you'd be very different, unless you're a total misanthrope without any friends.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Kymus View Post

    Sparring? Only point sparring. Continuous sparring was a rarity, I was told. IMO, the point-sparring thing was likely for tournaments.
    at some point, CMA guys began to think this light game like sparring was real... I think maybe when they convinced themselves they were so deadly they thought they could only play faggy games of tag

    After CTS passed, we met and trained briefly with another coach from guangdong. He has been on coaching staff with CTS.... he treid to impress us to get us as students. He said "I used to spar all the coaches and I was always the winner"

    My si-dai, Stephen Innocenzi, asked "so you beat CTS also?"

    CTS was already deceased, yet the guy went sort of pale and shook his hand pretty furiously... he corrected himself

    "no, we did sparring, not fighting. No one did this with your teacher (CTS) because he didn't play, he hurt people"

    CTS had been exposed to western boxing. I think the people who were exposed to western boxing learned what sparring really was. The people who did not go outside of TCMA kept playing tag
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkfmdc View Post
    at some point, CMA guys began to think this light game like sparring was real... I think maybe when they convinced themselves they were so deadly they thought they could only play faggy games of tag
    IMO, point sparring could be used as a tool. Like, a tactics thing of getting the first strike or something, but it pales (greatly) in comparison to real sparring. It's foolish to think that one is just the same as the other. It baffles me that people with 2x the experience I have seem to think otherwise. I can only think that they've only ever sparred people of the same (or similar arts) and have never actually been challenged or been in a real fight, for that matter.

    "no, we did sparring, not fighting. No one did this with your teacher (CTS) because he didn't play, he hurt people"
    Yeah, I think even with continuous sparring, it's easy to develop bad habits. Heck, it wasn't until I met my JJJ teacher that I ever thought about grabbing my opponent's clothing to throw them, control them, choke them, etc. We limit our experience because we don't want to hurt the guy. A balance is needed. Minimal padding, with as much force as possible without serious injury.
    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    like that old japanese zen monk that grabs white woman student titties to awaken them to zen, i grab titties of kung fu people to awaken them to truth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sal Canzonieri View Post
    You can discuss discrepancies and so on in people's posts without ripping them apart. So easy to do sitting behind a computer screen anonymously, but in person I'm sure you'd be very different, unless you're a total misanthrope without any friends.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Yum Cha View Post

    Here's the question in my mind, if you have two options, or 3 or more, in a situation, which do you choose? If you are a striker who has a little x-training to understand grappling, do you grapple or strike? Can you afford the time to think about it?
    If I can see you are a good grappler but not a good striker, I want to strike you

    If you are a striker with no wresting, I want to wrestle and/or submit you

    When you punch, I kick

    When you kick, I punch

    If you wrestle, I knee

    If you knee, I wrestle

    The art of war talks about "local superiority",,,, you fight them where they are weak, not where they are strong
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by lkfmdc View Post
    If I can see you are a good grappler but not a good striker, I want to strike you

    If you are a striker with no wresting, I want to wrestle and/or submit you

    When you punch, I kick

    When you kick, I punch

    If you wrestle, I knee

    If you knee, I wrestle

    The art of war talks about "local superiority",,,, you fight them where they are weak, not where they are strong
    We agree in principle, but not in execution. "Fight them where they are weak....." can mean a lot of things, including using surprise and unfamiliar attacks.
    This is my rant, you don't respond to your opponent wherever possible, but make him respond to you. Even if you step right, forcing him to adjust, you are starting to dictate the engagement.
    Just like BJJ says to consolidate, then submit, I think the same, consolidate an advantageous situation and attack. That situation may be an expected attack from the other person, with their hands because you wrong footed them, or the like. Initially attacking their balance to weaken a counter, and then pouncing like a tiger with whatever you got, generally knees and elbows, break a knee if you get the chance. All over rover.
    Straight blast is what Lee called it, its nothing new. And you gotta have plan B.....
    Guangzhou Pak Mei Kung Fu School, Sydney Australia,
    Sifu Leung, Yuk Seng
    Established 1989, Glebe Australia

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Yum Cha View Post

    This is my rant, you don't respond to your opponent wherever possible, but make him respond to you.
    some people are aggressive, others are counter fighters, the style can not make the man, only inform him
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

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