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yamato_damashii
01-14-2001, 10:40 AM
I'm wondering if someone could recommend a good Shaolin Five Animals instructor...

Jason C. Diederich

<A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/shaolinninjamarine/" TARGET="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/shaolinninjamarine/</A>

ngokfei
01-14-2001, 05:54 PM
I know that Doc Fai Wong has a unique 5 animal form.

Also the Choy Li Fut style has 10 differnet animals that they teach.

Hung Ga also is an exponenet of the 5 animals.

I don't know but I'm sure that any of the modern shaolin monks from china know a 5 animal set as well. :D

count
01-14-2001, 06:54 PM
Too bad Ark Wong is gone. If you can contact Richard Vera in Los Angeles area, I'm sure he can help. I just don't have a recent number for him. He learned Ark's complete system and his Iron Palm is the best I have ever seen.Ï

Black Fist
01-15-2001, 01:07 AM
How about Wing Lam and Hay Say Fu 5 animals....you could even see if you like it via tapes first.

Erasmus Lightstone
01-26-2001, 10:06 AM
Black Fist,

Can you tell me where I can get a copy of the Ha Say Fu 5 animal videos? Thanks.

Kevin73
01-26-2001, 07:29 PM
I realize you addressed this to someone else but I thought I'd answer.

You can get the tapes at
www.wle.com (http://www.wle.com)

They sell the tapes seperate for about 39.95 and 49.95 ea. or they have a package deal for $199.99 for all 5 animals seperate (panther,tiger,snake,crane dragon) and the 5 animals set (hung gar) where all 5 animals are together in one set.

"There are many who talk of the Way, but few who walk the Way."

johnv
04-19-2002, 06:42 AM
Does anyone know where I might find a list of forms used in the curriculums of 5 animal shaolin styles ?

David Jamieson
04-19-2002, 07:33 AM
Hi John-
Shaolin Five animals is taught in a few different ways.
The five animals being /tiger/crane/leopard/snake/dragon.

In Hung Gar, the five animals are taught in a form called Ng Ying Kuen or "five animals fist"

In old hung gar, the forms are taught seperately.

tiger=foo
crane=hok
leopard=pao ("pow")
snake=she/se
dragon=Lung (leung or loong)

in other systems, especially those of shaolin origin, each of the qualities and attributes of these animals are incorporated into sets. while the sets may have different names or only emphasize a part of an animals characteristics in combat, the essence of the animal form is still there.

virtually all styles of kung fu that have their origins in Shaolin have a touch of the animal flavours in them.

Check out this site further (beyond the forums) and you will find tapes for watching regarding animal styles as well as associated weapons, books et al.

good luck
peace

johnv
04-19-2002, 07:45 AM
Thanks for the information! I was mainly trying to find a list of the names of the forms. The reason being, I'm trying to locate information about a form someone taught me. They said it was one of the basic or introductory "shaolin 5 animal" forms, and I'm trying to find out more about it. Unfortunately, I'm not in contact with the person who taught me. All I know is that in English, the name of the form roughly translates to "four pillar", "four directions", or "four gates"....something similar to that anyway.

I don't believe it was Hung Gar based - it didn't quite have that look to it. It had a slightly more "Northern" feel to it. But who knows, I could be wrong. My experience in Shaolin is very limited.

FRANK SEXTON
07-30-2002, 08:43 AM
John

Sounds like you have the Hunan or northern Shaolin form.
4 Gates is right. 5 animals 4 gates. Tiger, Crane, Leopard, Snake guard or protect the gates. The Dragon protects the middle or the inner circle. Do you know what system it was your teacher was in because alot of animal forms out there are not true. People change them or add and subtract things from them to create or satisfy thier own system. Hope I can help you in anyway.

Your friend
Sifu: Frank Sexton

johnv
07-30-2002, 09:13 AM
I'm guessing it was a Vietnamese style. I say that because the guy knew the names of the forms in English and Vietnamese, but not in Chinese. The same style also had another form called "Stone Lion", if that helps out in any way.

Thanks,
John

Ben Gash
08-15-2002, 04:40 PM
Stone Lion is a Bak Mei/Lung Ying form done by some lineages (it's a version of Sup Ji Kuen). There's a form from the same lineage called Say Moon Ba Gwa , or 4 doors 8 diagrams. Could that be the one?
The only northern 5 animals form I know personally is Wu Xing Ba Fa (5 animals 8 ways), a fairly basic Shaolin set.

johnv
08-15-2002, 04:49 PM
That's the closest guess I've heard of yet. Are there any websites or videos that may show those forms ? That way I can see for sure if it's the same one.

Ben Gash
08-17-2002, 01:47 AM
You're probably best off talking to Mantis 108 on the soutern forum.

netfreak
01-28-2003, 10:19 AM
Does anyone know about a certain "Five animal style" kung fu? I know that there were five animals that kung fu evolved around of (snake, crane, tiger,leopard,dragon), but isn't each a separate style of kung fu? Or is it just one complete system? Thanks in advanced.

sct82abn
01-30-2003, 08:52 PM
yes it's what i study, and he is right it mixes moves of each animal
Fun!:D

netfreak
01-31-2003, 06:14 AM
Thanks for the input guys.

Scythe
02-08-2003, 06:39 AM
Five animal gung fu is all one style, The snake, tiger, leopard, crane and dragon though not practiced this way in all systems are a series of grips and grip releases. The archetypal five animal form is Rokushu (Tensho in Japanese karate) All of which can be appplied in Saamchin based pushing hands.

snake_fists_18
02-09-2003, 12:44 PM
Does the five fists have fixed positions? I saw in the movie "Spirtual Kung Fu" done by Jackie Chan he uses the five fists to defeat the seven fists. i was wondered where all those moves fixed or can they be like more flauently done?

No_Know
02-09-2003, 12:55 PM
Theoretically there would be fixed postures and you would learn that first. The more comfortable you were with the individual postures in the form (s), The more you could apply any of them in whatever order fluently.

Or some such perhaps

snake_fists_18
02-09-2003, 12:56 PM
cheers

bodhitree
02-12-2003, 08:23 AM
Does anyone know a 5 animals form nian shou chaun and is it any different than lian huan chaun, it looks like some of you have experiance in the art.


home in the here in the now

bull895
06-19-2006, 04:44 PM
I am curious if anyone has any info on the five animals system from shaolin. Is it still being practiced by members of the temple? I am currently studying a five animals system and have been looking for more information on the system and it seems to drop off the map fairly quick. History or legend take your pick, has it being an origional system of Shaolin but besides offshoots in certain systems, and a form in others. I have not found much. Any leads would be of great help.

mantis108
06-20-2006, 11:06 AM
Here's a rewrite of an post that I made a long time ago:

Bak Mei has quite a few poems and couplets. Here is one of my favorites.

仙人指點龍蛇鶴
Xian Ren Zhi Dian Long She He
(Immortals instructs the Dragon, Serpent, and Crane)

師傅真傳虎豹形
Shi Fu Zhen Chuan Hu Bao Xing
(Teachers transmits the Tiger and the leopard forms)


Please note that in Chinese, the couplet was written with 7 characters on each phrase. The word "Xing" (forms) on the second phrase seemed to be extra to match up the phrase. It seems redundant.

Personally, I find it adds to the couplet a different dimension. IMHO, it serve 2 purposes. I shall discuss it below.

Let's take them apart:

Immortals: this shows the Daoist origin of the style and implies also the metaphysical facet of the art.

The Five animals:

Dragon is majestic in its "Shen" 神 - the perceptive spirit in the form of vital energy. Let your opponent feel the grandeur of your presence.

Serpent is venomous in its "Xin" 心 heart/mind. Evaluate your opponent, calculate your options and capitalize on his weaknesses. Be deceptive at all times.

Crane is graceful when it is airborn. The dance with its two feet is most beautiful to behold. It is the "Yi" 意 the intent that dominates at will the fight on the ground or during flight.

These three animals show the metaphysical aspects and internal nature of the style.

Tiger is tyranious in its "Li" 力 the strength that ferocity commands your opponent's respect. Pouncing, catching, tearing and dispatch him like Tiger preying on the lost lamb.

Leopard is fierce in its "Shi" 勢 the determination and dispositions. Agressively stalk the prey, stands its ground never retreating and strike terror into the core of your opponent's very being.

The five animals together show the Southern Shaolin connection of Bak Mei. It is of note that Bak Mei is more akin to Jiangxi Liu Men Jiao in its believe system which is Daoist inclined.

Shifu and Xing imply physical aspects and external nature.

Xing also makes up the 7th Character.

The coulpet is than to illustrate that:

1. Metaphysical aspects and internal teachings are "the essence" and are so hard to grasp that only the immortals are capable of instructing the student when he is ready.

2. The physical aspects (power, strength, forms, dispositions, etc.) are the external teachings, which the Shifu can transmit in person. Learning by imitation is the primary steps in the process. Also felines in the wild learn their hunting and fighting skills by play fighting with their parents and siblings. It is no difference in learning Kung Fu.

If we see a performance that seems to have all the power and the right movements but something is amiss, we know that the Shifu has done his best. It is the essence, which is missing. That is up to the student to learn the ultimate truth of the art. He has to find himself in the Kung Fu.

Just sharing some thoughts.

Mantis108

Jingwu Man
06-21-2006, 10:49 AM
I know the shaolin 5 shape 8 method form (Wuxing bafa quan) from the temple. My teacher learned it from a folk master in henan province, but i've seen the monks at the temple do a variation of the same form ( or is it me doing the variation?). So it is still around somewhere.
The first line is tiger, 2nd is leopard, 3rd is dragon, 4th is snake and crane .
All the descriptions mantis108 gave are excellent for the spirit of each animal, cuz without the spirit, you look a little silly clawing the air for a minute and a half.

I know that shaolin teaches the individual forms for the five animals, but all i've seen are performance forms with a few moves that lead into an inside fall or a suicide. Not what I'd call traditional, but I'm sure the older generation monks know some cool stuff.

Oh yeah, there is the black tiger form. That's pretty cool.

ramble ramble ramble. Hope this helps.

Shaolin Master
06-22-2006, 04:22 AM
Qin family Wuxingbafaquan. This is actually practiced in Beijing area as it is a part of the Da Jinggangquan system of the Qin family. There are two sets one of 108 and another of 72.

In the 80's some students of the Qin family and Shaolin developed a short abrdiged version which has since been practiced in the temple.

The so called suicide forms are just for show new inventions .....

The ancient Wuquan (5 Boxing) is still existent but since there weren't real inheritors the development of the sets from quanpu and quantu (drawings) has led to a funny interpretation by current practioners of shaolin temple.


Hope that helps

Cheers,
Wu Chanlong

Lau
06-22-2006, 08:19 AM
Hi Robert,

You definately deserve a star on the kung fu walk of fame for that translation and explanation!!! One day you should sit back and write a book on Pak Mei poetry and it's explanations, I'll be your first customer :-)

This poem makes me proud to be part be training Pak Mei. Best regards, Lau

mantis108
06-22-2006, 02:50 PM
How goes it, my friend. :)

Thank you very much for the generous kind words and compliments. :D I am only doing my very little share.

Bak Mei as a traditional Kung Fu should be documented and preserved for the future generation IMHO. It would be great to do a book project on it someday. Just having a chance of talking to the elders and getting their story down on paper is a wonderful thing already.

Warm regards

Robert

Jingwu Man
06-23-2006, 11:40 AM
Here's me doing the five animal form I know.
A bit sloppy, it was shot in 2003.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GaRqElpBjE

Banjos_dad
06-23-2006, 06:05 PM
when i hear 5 animals i think more of a single form than a system, but my knowledge is very limited. it would be interesting to find out about such a system. everyone has heard of complete styles based on one animal: eagle claw, crane style, tiger syle, dragon style.
i wonder what it would 'feel' like to shift from one style to the other in the middle of an encounter, like evade an enemy's attack with a crane style move then reply with something from dragon.

DarkTiger
07-03-2006, 03:52 PM
what's the history of bak mei, and also does anyone know what the story was between shaolin and bak mei?

Shaolin Master
07-05-2006, 08:22 AM
History of Bak Mei:

A great master Cheung Laichun studied various Dongjiang region arts and developed Bakmeipai. The name and the shaolin connection is derived from a lovely novel on which many Shaw brothers films were also based.

Regards

Wu Chanlong

DarkTiger
07-05-2006, 04:02 PM
In heard somewhere that bak mei was considered a black art or somethin by shaolin, and that bak mei was in on some type of betrayal. is there any truth to that or is that part of a story. I also heard that his name is not to be spoken at shaolin, it all sounds like somethin from a movie, but still a good story, whether fact or fiction i'd still love to read it. any info?

Hopping Frog
07-17-2006, 02:20 AM
Taken from a book I own: Sometime in the early 18th century, the Fukien temple was betrayed by a senior monk, Ma Yee Yuk (or Ma Ning Yee), also known as 'Bak Mei'( or White Eyebrow). As legend tells it, Ng Mui, Gee Sin, Mew Hing, Hung Si-kwan, and Fung To-tuk all escaped and dispersed to spread their arts in safety.

Apparently, Bak Mei was deeply interested in the Taoist quest for immortality, and betrayed the Shaolin Temple to aid the Manchu Imperials, and was rewarded with access to knowledge and worldly control over other Taoists. Since certain Taoist societies (or so I've read) were known to give their leaders symbolic names, it is opssible that Bak Mei was later assumed as a title. That is why the name Bak Mei actually appears in many different spots in the timeline.

So basically, Bak Mei was the original Darth Vader. I got that information from the Shaolin Gradmaster's Text, so think what you will of it.

DarkTiger
07-19-2006, 11:51 AM
Thanx a milloin HF, no one would ever talk about that like it was the plague or something. Finally somebody that will speak.

godzillakungfu
07-19-2006, 12:11 PM
No, it is so convoluted that people hate speaking about it at all.

Notice you keyed in on the more confrontatinal story, as opposed to the earlier one.


Oh, on the story from the text you might want to read this post.

http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/forum/showpost.php?p=593400&postcount=142

mok
07-24-2006, 10:23 AM
I am curious if anyone has any info on the five animals system from shaolin. Is it still being practiced by members of the temple? I am currently studying a five animals system and have been looking for more information on the system and it seems to drop off the map fairly quick. History or legend take your pick, has it being an origional system of Shaolin but besides offshoots in certain systems, and a form in others. I have not found much. Any leads would be of great help.

Northern shao lin as taught in or near songshan hasn't kept much of the "animals" at all, and concentrates more on later longfist elements (tan-tui, mui-fa, cha-quan, etc). With the exception perhaps of northern mantis or eagle-claw schools which are essentially lay-person styles derived from temple boxing.

Many of the southern shaolin systems however, have kept animals within their curriculum, especially the 5 family styles (also lay-person styles) Hung Ga, Choy Ga, Mok Ga, Lau Ga, and Li Ga.

I would suggest taking a good look at Hung Gar (also known as Hung Ga, Hung Ga Kuen, or just Hung Kuen) as it is the most widely taught actual "5-animal" style today. Try looking at this board's southern kung-fu thread, or google it up - there's plenty of material available.


cheers,

David Jamieson
07-24-2006, 04:45 PM
Here's me doing the five animal form I know.
A bit sloppy, it was shot in 2003.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-GaRqElpBjE

hey does david cliff still run that school?

Meklorien
07-24-2006, 06:45 PM
History of Bak Mei:

A great master Cheung Laichun studied various Dongjiang region arts and developed Bakmeipai. The name and the shaolin connection is derived from a lovely novel on which many Shaw brothers films were also based.

Regards

Wu Chanlong

WTF????!!!!!!!

Meklorien
07-24-2006, 06:47 PM
Taken from a book I own: Sometime in the early 18th century, the Fukien temple was betrayed by a senior monk, Ma Yee Yuk (or Ma Ning Yee), also known as 'Bak Mei'( or White Eyebrow). As legend tells it, Ng Mui, Gee Sin, Mew Hing, Hung Si-kwan, and Fung To-tuk all escaped and dispersed to spread their arts in safety.

Apparently, Bak Mei was deeply interested in the Taoist quest for immortality, and betrayed the Shaolin Temple to aid the Manchu Imperials, and was rewarded with access to knowledge and worldly control over other Taoists. Since certain Taoist societies (or so I've read) were known to give their leaders symbolic names, it is opssible that Bak Mei was later assumed as a title. That is why the name Bak Mei actually appears in many different spots in the timeline.

So basically, Bak Mei was the original Darth Vader. I got that information from the Shaolin Gradmaster's Text, so think what you will of it.

Okay, this one's much better....

Jingwu Man
07-25-2006, 02:22 PM
hey does david cliffe still run that school?

Yup. He's my teacher and my inspiration! Now that he;s gone to Shaolin a few times, he's even crazier!
How do you know my Sigong? Did you ever train with him?

shaolin_allan
01-26-2010, 07:32 PM
Can I get your opinions on this school? He is a student of Shi Yan Ming. They teach New Shaolin 5 animal, arhat, and luohan, and the shaolin version of chen taijiquan as well. They also have a youtube page http://www.youtube.com/user/AZShaolinKungFu. I apologize if this is the wrong place to post this in advance. I want to learn martial arts I can defend myself with. Here is their school website http://www.azshaolinkungfu.com/ I live out in Surprise, AZ and i'm having trouble finding a good school.

LFJ
01-26-2010, 07:52 PM
He is a student of Shi Yan Ming. They teach New Shaolin 5 animal, arhat, and luohan, and the shaolin version of chen taijiquan as well.

who is "he"? there's no information on the instructor, but i recognize the logo. i think "he" posts here occasionally.

what is "new" shaolin 5 animals?

luohan is chinese for arhat.

shaolin_allan
01-26-2010, 07:57 PM
His name is Bryan Donovan, he may post here. I was just unsure if these styles taught and the fact that it's new shaolin stuff means that I can't use it for good self defense, thanks.

Shaolin
01-26-2010, 09:35 PM
Correction, was a student under Shifu Yan Ming, I don't live in New York any longer. I think there might be a typo on the site about "new shaolin". Go to my current site www.MartialArtsAz.com. 5 animal systems are southern chinese martial arts and kenpo karate. 5 animals 8 methods is a routine I teach along with small and large arhat which translates to xiao louhan quan and da louhan quan (louhan/arhat means enlightened one).