View Full Version : Iron Palm, Iron Crotch, Iron Shirt Issue

03-11-2003, 08:16 PM
Gene -

I was very disappointed in the issue mentioned above. It appeared to be full of propaganda. What group of martial artist was the issued aimed at this time. I can't believe that you would think my Iron Palm Brothers and I would be impressed with this particular issue.

03-12-2003, 09:03 AM
That's sounds funny from an iron palm proponent. We received more positive feedback on that issue, the most for this year so far. Many of our compliments were for iron palm and iron body practitioners, so I'm not clear on what you found so objectionable.

We don't really aim for any audience in particular with our issues - there are special focus issues certainly, but it would be silly for us to make out special focus so special to exclude any of our readership.

Can you be a little more specific with your feedback?

03-15-2003, 04:18 AM
Gene -

It is passed and so it is forgotten. Thanks for the reply.

herb ox
03-15-2003, 12:03 PM
I may not be a master of anything yet, so perhaps my opinion is not of weight and expertise, but I really enjoyed the above-mentioned issue. Especially Gary Shockley's article on the Physics of Breaking... it was rather refreshing to see a more impartial view of the "stunts" often performed by iron body heroes. I felt it added a much needed balance to the amazing feats of strength the casual observer may take for granted.

Of particular interest was the article on Shi Guolin, and I really enjoyed the translated martial sayings - now we have insight as to what goes through a Shaolin monk's mind... I've always wanted to know!

And of course, the Master Tu article... well, I suppose I'm a fan. But actually having witnessed the feats he performed firsthand may have had something to do with it!

I don't see what was so offensive with the issue. I thought it was one heluva job... well done!:D

03-17-2003, 09:38 AM
I'm sorry if I came off defensive, but I really do want to know what you and your iron palm brothers disliked about that last issue. Obviously there's no way to satisfy everyone with every issue, but knowing your association to iron palm, I'm very curious what elicited your initial post.

03-17-2003, 10:16 AM
Okay -fine. Thank you.

Herb ox : Thank you

03-18-2003, 09:03 AM
Let me get this right, you post a rather scathing yet ambiguous criticism, then don't back it up with any real commentary? What's up with that?

I created this forum with the intention that people make comments to our department directly, in a live public web forum. No other magazine offers this like we do. It's becuase we want to hear what you think. We want feedback. You can't just put our some negative criticism without supporting it. It's poor wude. It's criticism interuptus. ;) Seriously, if you have some criticism, bring it on, we aren't going to bite. Well, not hard at least. We'll address it like any critique, as best and as fairly as we can.

herb ox
03-18-2003, 11:40 AM
I found the following thread here (http://martial.best.vwh.net/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=20610) which does elaborate upon the issue at hand...

I'd personally like to know what Mantak Chia's perspective is on the Iron Crotch... a new thread perhaps?


03-18-2003, 06:00 PM
Now some dialog can occur. First of all, I'll narrow my focus to the Iron skills, since that seems to be the focus of the criticism.

As for us wanting to buy our videos, well, that's a fair cop. We always want you to buy videos. It's one of the many ways we support the magazine. We do the same with products. All the magazines do, unless you have some outrageously high cover price, you don't make money through newsstand sales. It's all about the advertising. But FWIW, we have some pretty exciting products to offer and the magazine is a good way to showcase them. That's not really propaganda, it's plain old economics. I'm afriad everyone will have to live with advertising. If it's just starting to bother you now, welcome to the American way.

As for training tips, that's a fair point too. The direction of the issue was more to expand the awareness of different iron disciplines - we wanted to show it from several perspcetives - Buddhist, Taoist, Military and Scientific. We didn't really offer "tips," but we did offer some simple training methods. I'll consider having more of a tip-like emphasis in the future. Good comment. Perhaps you'll submit something?

As for Mantak Chia, I respect his work immensily. I will respect his discussion of Iron Crotch even more when he starts towing trucks. OK, seriously, no offense, but there are many roads to the mountain top. When you think one road is best, perhaps you're not seeing the whole mountain.

03-19-2003, 11:26 AM
I did express an opinion Gene. But again, it is passed and no comment is needed. All is well. Thank you.

03-20-2003, 09:16 AM
And I expressed an opinion on your opinion. I'm only trying to create a dialog - after all, this is a forum, and one good opinion deserves another. :D

03-27-2003, 05:02 PM
mind****- are you no_know's twin?

I liked the articles, thought the intr to the iron palm article was a little strange. Like "Everyone knows what thugs the chinese military are. just ask the Tibetans!! So they must know their stuff!!!"

I happen to study the chinese military style (the class is called Kuo shu), but don't practice iron palm.

03-28-2003, 09:04 AM
"China's Cultural Revolution, shadowed by its strong arm tactics in tibet and Tiananmen, earned tehir enforcement departments one of the most draconian reputations in the world." I never said they were "thugs." I was just making a point about the no-holds-barred quality, the intensity, of their practice.

And no_know is one of my favorite forum sparring partners. There's great power to the mind**** on the forum - and it's such an easy ploy since most members aren't very cohesive writers. Besides, it's the net - it's all about virtual ****s. ;)

herb ox
03-28-2003, 10:58 AM




03-31-2003, 05:14 PM
Maybe you should do an article on SS torture techniques. They're reknown for their effectiveness. If that's the direction you're taking things

Design Sifu
04-03-2003, 04:02 PM
How about you submit an article on the topic and let Gene deside based on the article's quality?


04-06-2003, 07:55 AM
because it's horrible idea!! what are you: a terribleman?

herb ox
04-06-2003, 11:22 AM

04-22-2003, 03:45 PM
... but it would be a pretty tacky tie tack to tack my tie here. When I wear a tie, that is. I'm not ready to draw a comparison between Chinese cops and the SS. After all, I hve friends that are Chinese cops. Nevertheless, I think that the martial applications of Chinese military and police are absolutely fascinating. Many westerners put down Chinese arts because it's too flowery, but they haven't seen or felt the effectiveness of the military police stuff yet.

Actually, speaking of torture, I was kind thinking about a piece on Buddhist hell...

04-24-2003, 03:31 PM
my teachers teacher (he calls him sipa ) was a soldier in the chinese army and we learn that style.

04-28-2003, 09:19 AM
... and I did have one, was that when we think of police tactics, we generally think of street effective techniques - yet incidents like the Rodney King beating are considered excessive. In China, excessive force in enforcement is par for the course. So their combat techniques are worthy of analysis.

05-26-2003, 06:24 AM
kind of off topic here. I was reading your article in the ezine. Wanted to mention that I read an article in an airline magazine a few years ago about Shaolin. Just for your press history. Lot of people probably saw it. They were a captive audience after all. This must've been like 5 years ago. I don't remember which monk it was. It said that certain monks had made their training nearly impossible so as to discourage would be action stars from getting a pedigree from there. just remembered that

05-27-2003, 09:37 AM
Actually, like I said in my other article (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/ezine/article.php?article=350), it's gotten way too big to keep track of it all now. Which is why I hadn't published that article after it's initial submission years ago.

05-31-2003, 11:01 AM
Also off topic. I noticed in the article on the Chen family a few issues back, one of them had joined the army for 4 years. If you ever get a chance, I'd be curious to hear him discuss some if any of tha parrelels between the two types of training. I kind of am doing something similar on a relatively microscopic level.

06-02-2003, 09:29 AM
Hmmm, we do a lot on Chen style. In fact, I think we led the way and all the other CMA magazines followed. So I'm not sure which article you were refering to exactly.

A lot of martial artists in China have police/military ties - I've always felt that's an interesting aspect, especially since many Chinese police don't carry guns. Talk about reality training...

06-03-2003, 02:25 PM
it was the one with chen bing, chen this, chen that. the kiddos of the chen family. nevermind

06-04-2003, 10:05 AM
That was in our Jul Aug 2002 (http://ezine.kungfumagazine.com/magazine/article.php?article=234). Actually, I don't know any of those guys - to the best of my knowledge they are all still in Chenjiagou.