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prana
11-20-2001, 02:40 AM
I have had a smallish realisation last night.

But this question aims at anyone who is interested in Qi-Gong or practises energy controls of other sorts. Wongsifu, Repulsive Monkey, ABandit, Fish, Mantis, and others I have left out....

When sleeping with the mind set at the mid heart, I am unable to get to sleep properly. Dreams are lacking, even sleep is fairly hard to come by. Usually the mind returns to its monkey state before I am able to fall asleep.

When sleeping, with the mind at the throat behind the adams apple, the mind sleeps with strong recollection of dreams. Perhaps this is the gateway to lucid dreaming, and the ability to recognise dreams.

A dumb dream, such as todays, a lizard decapitates a persons head with a sword. It then comes after me at a ferocious pace. I duck, and it lands, and again I follow it out of curiosity. I see it at the corner, it comes at me again, this time at my leg. I am shaken, fight it, and wake up in fear, that I am to be decapitated.

A dumb dream to most/all of you, but to me, a constant reminder of the torment a human being has to traverse in the path of death. In fear, one runs from the creatures that are out to kill you, a highly modified creature of the current/many past lifes, coming back to haunt you, creatures you are inclined to be curious, hurt, kill manifesting in its evil states. Or the constant attachment, the curiosity to watch this lizard, and hence causing this collapse into the lower states of mind, fear whatever. Remember this is how your karma is manifests, and the state of your mind at the end of this life, gives rise to the next.

So what does Qi-Gong have to say. Energy at your throats, heart ?

*** Again this question does not apply to anyone who is disinterested in Qi-Gong, I mean to offense if it is offensive in nature to anyone.

Repulsive Monkey
11-20-2001, 11:13 AM
Yep, from the Tibetan traditions this is an abo****e practice. When going to sleep bringing the mind to settle on the throat energy centre WILL make you have lucid and vivid dreams, as this centre, as well as cultivating Clairaudience, general expresses emotions that one needs to voice, and does so in your dreams. When allowing the mind to reside in your heart centre when going to sleep, it should bring about deep dreamless sleep. What this means is that it doesn't really leave you without dreams at all (becasue everyone dreams every single night fact!), but allows your Shen to return to its natural residency i.e. the heart blood, it is then secured and allows deep undisturbed sleep, so deep in fact that you will awaken without remembering your dreams. The dream you speak of Prana (and I am not dream interpreter by trade!!)could very well be a need you have to express something to yourself on a sensitive level, maybe even spiritual. I have no tools within my knowledge to interpret characters or objects from dreams, I usually do better on feelings in dreams.

Nexus
11-20-2001, 06:31 PM
Prana, very interesting information! I usually do meditation before I go to sleep, mostly standing, but lately I have been doing sitting meditation, and it has a very direct affect on dreaming and remembering them when I awake.

On the topic of dreams, I had a fascinating one last night.

I was having one of those restless nights, where I would sleep for an hour and wake up, and I was having dreams during each of these "inbetween hours" but none of them stuck out like the very last one I had.

I have had some stuffed up sinuses the last few days, and have felt a lot of energy in my upper burner, and have been doing sitting meditation rather then my usual standing before I go to sleep. Anyhoo...

I just laid back down after using the bathroom and I looked at a dresser by my wall. I then preceded to close my eyes, and suddenly I was looking through my eye-lids. I could see my entire wall, but my eyes were closed, and I could sense that I was using a lot of energy in the upper-burner to do so. I then panned around my room, and was able to make out all the objects in my room, exactly as they are. I was aware of what I was doing in my dream, and though perhaps this was some strange form of astral projection, but I wanted to be sure.

I have a sibling who usually watches tv in the early mornings, and I decided to look through the wall of my room, onto the other side of it which is the living room where the couches are. I did so, and I saw my sibling lying there with a blanket, and they were changing positions like someone on a couch would be doing to get comfortable. I also saw my mother folding clothes or doing something with her hands at the bottom of the couch.

I decided during this vision that I was using too much mental energy to do this, as I was feeling somewhat sick and didn't want to drain myself, so I decided to cut it off. I did so, and then opened my eyes and the lights were still off in my room.

I decided to get up and out of bed and see if my sibling was actually on the couch!

Everybody happened to still be sleeping...

Now, beyond what is said above, everything else that could be said about this would be complete interpretation. Was it just a dream? Was I actually in a state of consciousness during this activity? Was I seeing time from the fourth dimmension rather then the third?

I'd be interested in hearing what anyones interpretation of what I experienced or if you have had similar experiences.

prana
11-21-2001, 01:38 AM
Repulsive Monkey

Thanks. I do have a good feel about what that dream was about. You see, before I started meditation, I used to witness an olympian shoot lizards down with an air rifle for practise, he proceeded to be quite famous, many gold medals etc.
It is simply karmic returns, a small glimpse of what happens due to killing of these little creatures.
I understand better and better, everyday, the teachings of Padma Sambhava in the Book of the dead with these little reflections. Yet I am so extremely far...
I MUST build the ability to become able to control my behaviour of this bardo body in dreams. I have done it once or twice, but mastery is still a very extremely long road.


Nexus

Amazing visions. Might I say lucid magic dream body ? perhaps Bardo body in between sleeping and awaking.
You sound like you have very good control over your mind. Keep it up. I know someone who has similar experiences. I wonder if he is reading this thread :)

_________

Do you guys think it may be beneficial for me to write bits from the Tibetan Book of the dead on the internet ?

Mister Hansome
11-21-2001, 04:04 AM
Once when i was 11, i had a dream where i went to one of those chinese grocery stores; i went in admiring my surroundings and wondering along the aisles, when suddenly a giant crab came from the corner and started to chase me clamping its fierce pincers (the crab was standing upright, akward). So i ran around the store looking around for people and calling for help(i call for help and see many people yet no one came to my aid), it seemed that people thought i was kidding around with the crab. Just as i grabbed my aunts car keys and i ran for the car, as i tried to start the car the ellusive crab started at me. THE CAR WOULDN'T START.

SUDDENLY.....>

I woke up......and yet the dream continued, i saw the crab come at me when i closed my eyes and also when i opened them. This really freaked me out. I stubbled to my parents room through feel as i had only vague visions of the hallways as i had flashes of the continuing dream. When i saw my parents i told them a crab is chasing me, they looked at me with weird eyes. They told me to go to the sink and get some cold water, but i told them i am tired from the run and chase of the crab. So they went to the sink filling up the tub; then guided me in. As i went in i saw the dream though the reflection but as i stepped in the visions went away slowing as i put my head in.

This is probably one of the dream/nightmare i remember with greater detail then the rest; not because its scary but because it's weird, this was the first and only time this happened to me.

As the night ended i asked my parents to confirm what happened, they confirmed it alright.

The meaning of these dreams are probably useless now since its been a couple years, now i only have good dreams of happiness (mostly chicks).:)

I also have dreams where i foresee the future, like seeing a vision where i dwell in a house either than the one current; next i know a few months later it all happens the detail of the house is precise and everything seems deja vu.

Oh, and that point where every night someone has a dream, it seems to be true i always have a dream; i mostly wake up not remembering the details but i always remember that there was a dream. I guess it is true because when i was smaller i only remember only a few dreams maybe at that age my brain wasn't developed enough to remember them so they just discarded them leaving me clueless on if there was a dream or not.

Just freaky.

Just sharing! :D :D

Real Wisdom comes through experience!

Nexus
11-21-2001, 07:13 AM
Blue Man, very interesting dream. I often ponder on the dream world and its relation to the world perceived by our consciousness. Often the dream world is a reflection of our own, and often it is very distant and abstract.

I've had three dreams similar to the one you described blue man. The three dreams I had similar to yours were from my childhood, and I will describe them as I remember them below.

The first one was when I was very young, 4 or so years old. Funny thing is, I hadn't though of it for a long time until you described yours. Basically it goes as follows: I woke up, and sat up and in my door way was two tall figures, thin, but very tall, heads reaching the top of my door frame. Their faces resembled the bernstein bears but their bodies were human. I knew I was awake and was so scared I ran right by them, running under the arm of one which had its arm resting against my door frame. I ran into my bathroom where my mother was drying her hair, and told her all about it. She went back with me, but the bear-people were gone.

Another time, this one is more silly, I woke up and removed the covers from over my eyes only to see the california rasins dancing in the middle of my room. I was so scared, I threw the covers back over my eyes and hid their awake in my bed for half an hour before I creeped out of bed and went and woke my parents up.


The third dream, which was more deja vu as you described the last set. First let me say, when I was growing up, my bedroom was directly accross from my parents, so whenever I had bad dreams I would go to my parents. Basically, I had a vision of my body lying on the bed in my room, it was my first out-of-body experience I ever had. Then I saw my body levitating from the bed about 5 feet in the air, and it held their for a few moments. Then it dropped suddenly, very quickly, and I woke up as the body. I got up, and went to try and run into my parents bedroom but halfway accross my own room my legs stopped functioning, I collapsed in an indian crossed-legged position onto the floor. At this point I awoke instantanously from what seemed to be a dream within a dream, got up, ran half-way and the same thing happened. I then awoke another time and this time I made it all the way to my parents room. I was screaming dad, dad, wake up, wake up. My dad woke up, turned over and looked at me, and his face began to melt and mutate. Everything went dark and I woke up a final time again in my bed!

What was strange at this point in my last dream-within-a-dream sequence was that I was now afraid to go into my parents room for fear that they would mutate and not really be my parents but I was also afraid I was still stuck in the dream-sequence. I waited awake for quite awhile before I left my room after that.

Thanks Blue Man for your post, it sparked all three of the dreams above from memory. It was interesting to actually type them out and see them here on the forum.

Any thoughts?

- Nexus

TjD
11-24-2001, 08:32 AM
i'm quite interested in this...

in trying to live in a mindful/concentrated state - i always have trouble going to sleep;
it seems like i need my mind to wander off and start blabbing to fall asleep, its not what i need when im trying to keep my mind calm and mindful

by saying your mind at the throat/heart, do you simply mean opening the respective chakra and focusing on it, or actually bringing your mind to rest there?

if #2, how does one accomplish this?

i've had luck in the past with lucid dreaming and such things - but the actual process of falling asleep has always been a mystery to me :) anything that could help shed some light on that would definately be appreciated!

thanks
travis

Receive what comes, Escort what leaves, and if there is an opening, rush in

prana
11-25-2001, 12:06 AM
It is very difficult, and I have been trying everynight for about a year, and only a few occassions have I been able to do it.

You need to rest your mind at your throat (just behind the adams apple), and small, (poppy seed size) upright triangle glowing red (some other forms of yoga say it is blue).

Otherwise, you need to rest your mind at your heart center. It is a semi-circle, size of a poppy-seed, and glowing sky blue in colour.

When resting your mind, you are not seeing it with your eyes (like looking down from it), but merely easing your mind into & merging with it. So when you achieve it, you will be looking out from it as opposed to looking into it,

If you try too hard, you cant fall asleep. If you dont cencentrate enough, your mind wanders. If you can, you need to just relax in it, but it is extremely difficult (at least for me).

With bringing attention to your throat, sometimes it is simpler to begin this focus between a deep sleep and dream sleep, that is, if you are awaken at 4am, and returning to sleep.

With the heart center, bring your attention to it at the beginning of going to sleep.

Nexus
11-25-2001, 01:36 AM
Tjd, I recommend doing 10-15 minutes of sitting meditation before you go to sleep. Then when you lie down, concentrate on your breathing as if you were meditating while lying down. It is often said that people should not meditate while lying down if they do not wish to fall asleep, and trust me, before you know it, you are sleeping.

I used to have trouble getting to sleep as well, until one night after meditation I decided to lie down and focus on the breath. So I focus on the breath until I fall sleep, and it usually only takes 15-30 breaths, although I've never managed to keep count as I keep falling asleep right at the end :)

- Nexus

mantis108
11-25-2001, 01:38 AM
Yet another interesting thread. :)

IMHO, there are different types of dreams that have different functions. I can share 4 different types based on my own experiences:

1) Dreams that felt real (almost physical experience): I had this one dream of having an audience in Heaven with General Kwan (Kwan Gung), who worn a white robe (so did I). The feeling was that I was sort of in trial and finally get kick out (literally). I fell and could feel the clouds beside me. Finally, when I saw a bright light (the earth in energy form), I closed my eyes and I when head (crown) down. The immense pain woke me. I had a collision with the head board! (LOL...) I had this dream when I was a kid and until today I have no clue what this mean but that it's very very "physical". So this would be a dream that seems real but not much revelation.

2)Dream that actually came true: I had this dream that I was on a date with my first love piror to the real date. The sequence of events happened exactlly the same in the dream (minus the details of the background picture) within couple of weeks. That's the freakish yet of all dreams. Exact people, exact location, and exact events. So this would be dream that is Karmic.

3)Dream that forth warn future: I had this dream that I was chased by 7 rats (a sign of financial trouble that lasted 7 years long). I was finally saved by a Bodhidharma look a like who slayed the biggest and the toughest of the rats; hence, I was saved. For 7 years, I was in constant financial trouble. But after that I was doing fine.

4)The dreams which the body communicate its status: Dram about loosing a tooth (quite bloody), and I came down with a major flud that lasted more than a month. Piror to that I was health as a horse, I might have sniffle for an afternoon but by night I would be fine. BTW, Chinese has a book on deciphering dreams and their meanings. It is quite fasinating where the rats and tooth at least were on the mark. This dream, I believe, is the body's way of telling the mind that special attention is needed to paid to the body or sickness will result.

So looking at these "data" I believe that dreams do have different functions and is a way of the mind body communication (language of sort?). Just thought that I share with you.

"For in this sleep of death, what dreams may come?" Shakespeare

Mantis108

Contraria Sunt Complementa

TjD
11-25-2001, 01:47 AM
usually i do sitting meditation for 30-60mins before going to sleep, and after waking up :) good way to get ready for the day; and to wind down after a long one :) i've tried various kinds of ways to keep that mental state while going to sleep - but normally i always catch myself falling asleep (which ruins it)

prana -

thankyou very much :) i'll have to try it; i know what your talking about, for in trying concentration meditation where you focus on the tip of your nose (as opposed to the whole body); i've had my mind slip down there a few times :)

thanks everyone; good luck sleeping
peace
trav

Receive what comes, Escort what leaves, and if there is an opening, rush in

Qi dup
12-12-2001, 05:43 PM
Thank you everyone for the information posted on this thred. I've always been very interested in sleep and dreaming and since I've read and aplied some of the post my dreaming has become very interesting! Nothing quite as cool as what has been previosly mentioned, but I did have a interesting one were I was floating and then I started talking in my sleep but in my dream I wasn't saying anything but i could hear myself, kind of like in the never ending story. Anyway I woke up and still felt like my hands were floating and I couldn't quite move them at first!

Repulsive Monkey
12-22-2001, 04:13 PM
I dont manage it each time but one has to try and allow the mind to reside in these areas. One is trying to get to sleep first and foremost so one doesn't really want to start opening up enegry centres as this is a Yang activity, and nightime and sleep are Yin functions so naturally one will incur disharmony and the result will be insomnia. So you aren't trying to acivate things you are trying to induce things but with a Yin purpose or method.

Secondly, I too would just like to quote something famous about dreams from Chuang Tzu.

Once Chuang Chou dreamt he was a butterfly. He was happy as a butterfly enjoying himself fluttering from flower to flower and being trully one with nature. In his dream he WAS the butterfly completely. Suddenly Chuang Chou awoke where upon he was startled to realise that he was Chou again. Then he realised that he could not ascertain whether or not he, Chuang Chou, had only dreamt he was a butterfly or if the butterfly was now dreaming of being Chuang chou.


Night night and sweet dreams whom ever you may be!!!??? Thats if you really are dreaming!

once ronin
01-11-2002, 12:52 PM
to realize whether it is a dream or something controlled, has anyone tried looking at their lines on their hands knowingly in a dream?

this will put you in total control.

Nexus
01-11-2002, 01:03 PM
How about looking at the lines of your hands while you are awake and realizing you are in total control there also?

Repulsive Monkey
01-11-2002, 03:06 PM
He was taught that hand observation technique by DDon Juan Matus from the Toltec tradition. I like the Taoist response there Nexus.

once ronin
01-13-2002, 08:58 PM
this is a sad forum, sai yo!

Xebsball
01-16-2002, 06:39 AM
I actually got inside a girls dream one time.

I was kinda ****ed at her for her attitude, some meaningless stupid thing i cant even remember.
So before sleeping i focused on getting inside her head and telling her whatever i had to say (wich i also cant remember anymore).

Next morning at school she comes to me and says she had a dream with me...
I just ****ing frooze and couldnt reply it, i just stood there.

Altough i dont know if i hurt her in the process, now i tend to be carefull not to hate people cos i end up hurting them somehow just by intent, weird stuff.

once ronin
01-16-2002, 09:31 AM
not good, what if you got stuck or killed in the dream. no control.......

Repulsive Monkey
01-16-2002, 09:39 AM
yes and so what if he gets killed in the dream???? What afeect will that possibly have on him in the real world?? None. I've been killed in a dream before yet I continue to remain.

once ronin
01-16-2002, 01:40 PM
sounds like there is no experience here, most of all discussed here, could be from what someone read in a book.

you open a door and dont like what you see, you better be able to slam the door.

Qi dup
01-16-2002, 03:22 PM
that's cool Xebsball. I'm gonna try it tonight and see what happens.

Xebsball
01-16-2002, 08:50 PM
Mr. once ronin, so i guess my dream experiences are just not good enough for you?!? :mad: Nothing i ever do is good enough for you, im breaking up with you!

Qi dup, remember to only use the power for good.

Question:
Can someone tell me how many hours generally after you fall asleep would have dreams?

Xebsball
01-16-2002, 08:54 PM
Not dream related, but one time metalizating before sleeping i wanted to rain in the morning, when i woke up it was raining. I can never know if this was coincidence or not but if recall this happened when i was at the pick of my concentraition skills when i was 13 and also didnt have any martial art or qigong or any form of energy training at the time.

I remember thinking of manipulating a blue energy.

prana
01-16-2002, 09:38 PM
Hey Yo Xebsball

Hope you dont mind me quoting you cause that is the funniest thing I have read in a while ;) :p :cool:

edit: Generally after you wake up from your actual sleep, you are dreaming, but this is very general. If you sleep at say 10pm then maybe about 4am ? I found if you are fortunate enough to catch yourself dreaming and control your energies right there and then into certain areas direct your breathing into the 'avadhuti', it is powerful beyond belief and the sensation, there is no worldly experience that measures to it .... like your whole body is just pulsating in bliss. But then, soon you react cause you "wake up" and it is all gone.... ahahah D'oh

Xebsball
01-17-2002, 07:52 AM
Im flatered prana :D

Qi dup
01-17-2002, 06:45 PM
I don't think this will fully answer your question about when you actually start to dream, but here is a little information none the less. When you actually start to dream it's called REM sleep. REM stands for Rapid Eye Movement. As soon as you start to dream your eyes will start moving around in your eye socket, 'looking' at what ever is going on in your dream. I'm not exactually sure how long you have to be asleep for before the REM starts. I'm sure it very's quite a bit. People dream hundreds of dreams per night. I read about a study where they would watch people while they sleep and at the same time they were hooked up to a bunch of sensors and stuff to see what the brain was doing durring a dream. At the same time they covered the people eyes with those black eye covers you see old ritch ladies wear or at the shops downtown. Inside of the blind fold were small read lights. Now before the people went to bed they would tell them to remember and look for a flashing red light in there dream. So when there brain registered REM sleep, they would start the red lights a flashin'. Since they remember to look for the red light they would remember in there dream and there mind would realize they are dreaming. there bodies would remain asleep, but in there dream the were 'awake' and were free to do as they please. Have you ever slept through your alarm and then remember an alarm in you dream? This happen to me and for a second, I realized I was dreaming. It was a strange feelnig and then I quickly woke up. My dad tells me he's been able to be 'awake' in his dreams all his life. I've only recently had any success and it always seems to be real close to the end of the dream. It's always kind of confusing. I've also triend setting my alarm for the middle of the night and telling myself to listen for the alarm in my dreams. It works ok, but then the alarm seems to wake me up. I have no idea how this could relate to dreams and meditation. Prana, what do you think?

Mister Hansome
01-19-2002, 06:28 PM
Just sharing,

But once, last week (this happened before though), i forgot to set my alarm. I went to sleep and had a dream that was pretty weird to me. Every other dream i basically wen't through, one where i woke up and the dream continued, one where i keep on waking up into a dream, one where i see the future and it all comes through (every detail, every event came true it was like deja vu). Ok lets continue on the incident, so suddenly i had a dream (like always) i was flying over a body of water (probably the ocean). I was having fun passing by friends who were on cruise ships, passing by small islands, even by fish and meeting bird friends who could talk. SUDDENLY, my dream was interrupted by RING RING RING, a clock comes flying around me with wings on it ringing and ringing. I woke up at exactly 7:00, i mean EXACTLY (on the minute though not second the time i would usually set my clock to ring, i didn't check the seconds). I looked over to my clock and noticed that it wasn't set to ring. IT DIDN'T RING in the first place. My theory is that since i always set my clock at 7:00 my brain subconciously memorized it, noticing that their was no ring so it synthesized a ring of it's own imatating the ring of the clock.

Hey just sharing

Qi dup
01-20-2002, 07:55 AM
That's a cool dream Mister H. Especially the part where the clock has wings and it's flying around you ringing. Interesting. You'll find that your mind has a very accurate internal clock. Just think about when you want to wake up before you go to sleep and you probably will. Like if I have to wake up early for some reason I'll just tell myself to wake up before my alarm and it works. Let say you put something in the microwave for 3 min. You look at the time you set it for and then walk away to do something else. When ever I do this I always come back right as the three minutes are ending. Any one else ever noticed that?> our internal clock can do all kinds of cool stuff.

Mister Hansome
01-21-2002, 09:39 PM
:D :D :D

That's probably true, i do that all the time. I used to wake up WITHOUT an alarm clock everyday for a couple years at 7:00 pm, but this was a couple years ago. I find myself more dependent on clocks now, but if i want i bet i could do it again but don't want to risk it...what if i don't wake up and miss an important arrangement like school...ahh, i'm trying it tomorrow,kidding.

But the thing is that this was when i was dependent on the clock thinking that the clock would wake me up. I didn't know ahead of time that i didn't set the clock, i didn't tell myself to wake up or anything. It just happened. On the clock i just woke up.

:D :D :D

cherrypraxis
01-22-2002, 12:25 PM
this is my first post in this kungfumag forum...

this particular forum topic is fascinating. after reading several of the dream logs, i've decided to share this one that i've harbored for a long time now which also happened to have scared the living daylights out of me for several days after dreaming it last year. i wrote it out after waking up. it scared me so much that i was unable to sleep for about a month. i also thought i was going insane because after i read what i had written several hours later, i thought that i sounded like i was high on some kind of narcotic. i've had many dreams of similar content or of similar category (i just call them bizarre and most of my dreams that i remember make me think i'm going crazy).

i would appreciate any feedback because i often have dreams that are just saturated in symbolism and, usually, their "plots" are unbelievably fantastic...sometimes a bit too fantastic for my taste.

without further ado, my dream in its unexpurgated form in writing:

i had a dream. my eyes still close from grogginess. i don't think i am fully awake yet. i just thought that i should try to wake up a bit. i don't think i should go back to my room...by myself nor go to sleep soon. i had a nightmare. i dreamt that i had finished my manuscript but did not bear the title i had chosen for it. it was... debt witheld or some such thing. it jumps...stacks and stacks of these manuscpripts and bond paper that bore the title, such powerful title that a guy that i know, one of my peers at school who is filipino (that i feel has issues with his notions of identity) asked me where did i get such a title and commented that he read my piece and that it showed such great potential and all this in this blackened, deserted building, in all this debris and deserted blackened building. in that dream, i had lived in the third floor but sometimes, it shifted to the second floor that you had to climb up to in a spiral staicase that left a gap in the middle and you could see all levels. all doors in this burnt apartment had keys. there were only two or three levels. i was at the top. i had lost my key made of this strange material and it looked like a small switchblade and its purpose was to cut the lock and i had lost my key because i put it in my mouth and spat it out into the middle of the staircase after opening my door and i became afraid. i spat the key out. i looked down from where i was and saw all the debris down there. it gaped at me. it scared me. i went into my apartment and looked at my laptop computer that houses my manuscript and knew that this was the most important thing in the world and that it was the only copy. suddenly, i had my neigbors come in. i guess we shared the apartment since these girls were making themselves comfortable. some of them smoked and i remember fear enveloping me as i tried to keep calm and not worry about the manuscript in that laptop. i was smoking damp shrivelled up cigarettes that no one would take a puff from because they looked repulsive. i could not stop myself from smoking but my chest hurt from smoking. the pain made the fear go away and i needed it to keep calm and i knew all this. then i heard a commotion outside. i was the only one who seemed to hear it. i saw orange dust at first then peeked out through the window, staring into the night and saw a great smoke outside with people who seemed to be there and not there, running. upon closer look, i realized that it was in our building that this malign fire was burning. there was a force so great, so malign that it was burning and it was coming and its coming was inevitable and i knew all this in an instant and i was the only one to realize this. i screamed fire and the girls panicked and began running down to get out. i would not leave without my laptop thinking that this was the most important thing in the world. i took it, wires and all, and put it in a strange looking backpack even though the girls were telling me to leave it. i would not part with it. as we scrambled down the stairs, we all knew that it was more than just a fire, it was a force so malign that i grew afraid even though at this time, i knew that i was in a dream. this "fire" wanted to consume my laptop that housed my manuscript. there is something in the laptop that was too powerful that this adverse phantasm wanted it destroyed. i knew and i ran and i saw men eyeing my backpack and i knew that they wanted to steal it as if they knew what was within it. i clutched it tighter and ran into the night, clutched it tighter to the night and then clutched it til waking. i woke with my chest hurting and pounding and my legs felt stiff and hurt. (my chest still hurts a bit.) i felt as if there was something...malicious in my room. it had the whiff of malevolence that could slightly be felt but never palpably proven. i have been having these vivid dreams lately where i know that i am dreaming...and i know that it has something to do with my levels of consciousness. i feel as if i have broken some kind of barrier or that i am trying to move on but the move is so fast that i feel that i might die from it. i literally feel this way. there have been many things happening as i write and as i live these past weeeks that i feel that i could achieve enlightenment but it would mean the death of my body which i am not ready for. there is much to do. it seems crazy but i have been having these flashes lately, out of the blue. these flashes are, indeed, frightening. there is so much suffering in this world. i felt as if i saw and felt such great surging suffering and i had a brief glimpse of what it is meant to escape this suffering and it meant physical death of this body that i am not ready for. it can drive one mad. there is still something that binds me to this world and i felt, i felt my whole spirit denying this enlightenment because it would mean my death in a few days because this body will no longer be able to contain the light. this has happened in two instances already while i have been between being awake and being asleep and i feel that i am sometimes aware when i dream because i am in the third level of consciousness...
i am still groggy...but my eyes are more open.
i just realized what i have done here. i had to write out what i saw in that dream. it is an important one. for some reason, i feel that i am destined for something great because i would have left if i could but there is still some things left to be done. i feel as though i've denied myself that full awareness because that would strip me of what i need to accomplish what i need to do. i cannot be a perfect being for it. not yet...
at least, this is my interpretation of what has been going on.
as i engage myself even more deeply into my manuscript, i feel that i am getting closer to the truth and that truth will hurt perhaps for me but for many others as well.

prana
01-22-2002, 04:14 PM
First of all , welcome to the forum. Secondly , thanks for sharing your dreams with all of us. Thridly, I know you already know this, but re-emphasizing that , most of the time you are the ebst interpereter of your dream.

I think you have a good realisation then and there as you pointed out. In certain dream controls, it is a great achioevement to be able to realise during your sleep that you are indeed dreaming and be able to watch the dream as opposed to flowing in the dream itself. But in order to reach this level of dream control, you really have to ask yourself to recognise your dream first.

Secondly, I feel that you too are emphasizing on the theme of atachment towards the laptop, your life story the manuscript, and your actual physical body being your source of suffering.

I feel these are great things. Again, great story...

jon
01-22-2002, 04:33 PM
Hey, glad to see you made it over here, your dream caught my interest, ill tell you what i can see in it, take out what you will and reject whatever doesnt comply but try to at least consider my advice.

Your dream sounds to me like its representing your past and your bagage. The fire sounds like its reprenting change. Your afraid that this change is forced and not welcome so your hanging on to your past [laptop] in an attempt to not lose who you are in the upheavel. You need to let go of your laptop, all of its information [your thoughts and feelings] are there anyway they will not be lost, only shall we say - less easily accesed. Sounds like there is something subconsious which desires something to hold onto, a talisman if you will to represent who you are. You need to realise your mind and your spirit are not tangable, they cannot be kept in text and they cannot be confined to an object. Even your own body is incapable of holding onto such things, let them go where they will and educate you as they may. The way you discribe the 'levels' in your house - it also sounds like these represent what you may view as your own personal level.
You have obviously come a long way but at the same time fear being cast back. Take heed in the knowledge that your mind is your forge and your body is a tool built in its fire. You will not go backwards, you will only change direction.
Let go of your 'laptop' you have everything it does and more...
Your past makes up your experience it must not become your burdon.

cherrypraxis
01-24-2002, 10:25 AM
prana:

thank you for your response. i dreamt that dream last april. besides being a young college student, i'm also a writer and moonlight doing other things. at the time, i was in the middle of writing a manuscript. i have finished it this past summer and i have gotten relatively good feedback on it. (i.e. it is publishable)

around september (after the WTC incident), i was reading "thus spake zarathustra" by the german philosopher nietzsche and i had an epiphany. in it, nietzsche wrote about the "three metamorphoses" that symbolize what the 'overman' goes through--the camel who is burdened with baggage to cross through the desert, the lion who has to kill the dragon with the golden scales of "thou shalt," and finally, the child who is the beginning, learns everything and creates his own world. it was after reading this that i suddenly i remembered my dream about being in the 3rd level of consciousness. the only reason i say this is that i have always thought of my self as a little girl. i've had other experiences (in meditation and otherwise) that i have had this being as a little girl be my avatar. it is how i present my self. i never understood my "choice" of an avatar. it seemed to have just sprung. there was an incident that occured when i was 16 that cemented my opinion that i am "a little girl." it was when i was 16 that i had asked for someone to guide me (for the first time) and about a month later, i met a martial arts teacher who was substituting for my english teacher. i will not get into detail about that since it will be too lengthy but suffice to say that it felt like magic. one time, he, his then-girlfriend and i were meditating after a work-out session. even after they were done, i was still in meditation. when i came to, he said that he had an interesting experience. he said that he felt the spirit of a little girl who was being held by a little boy walk to him and the little girl blessed him as the little boy watched. then he asked his gf if she had done it since he assumed she had more meditation experience than i had. (after all, he just met me a few weeks earlier but i had no idea that it was called "meditation" when i was younger...i just routinely did something that in retrospect seems like meditation) after i heard him say what he said, i burst out crying. i said i had been visualizing about a little boy (where this little boy came from is another longer story that i won't get into because i've often been told as a child that i was imagining such things) and i was wondering if this teacher was my guide for a while. i found my answer...

i am not with that teacher now. i have moved on but i learned a lot from him and his school.

but, yes, i have a vivid/lively dream life and often times, i don't understand their meaning until months later. sometimes, i dream about frightening things that i know i fight in my dream because i know i am dreaming.

i am still quite sensitive about talking of these things for fear that i may be scorned. it wouldn't be the first time...



JON:

hey jon! yeah, i finally made it over here. =) thanks for your input and thanks for telling me about this forum. it's great!

i guess, i would have to agree with prana that often times, dreams have to be interpreted subjectively. you're on the mark though about something being a burden. it's not necessarily my past or my laptop (though understandably so for my laptop since i was anxious about my manuscript) that i feel attachment for. i'm not sure anymore but it's something that i'm trying to figure out.