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Thread: Judo

  1. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Judo is not just Kodokan Judo, that is based more on throws and pins then submissions.
    There is Kosen that is 90% submission work, but the truth is they don't compete that much in submission grappling...
    I'm with the mainstream Judo-ers that believe that modern Kosen is- well- a myth. It's true that the old school Kosen players in Japan were accomplished at newaza and were able to thus nullify their size handicap against the big Tokyo guys, but the Kodokan or should I say, Tokyo Judo Clubs took care of that with one of their famous rule changes "for the good of Judo". There is no Kosen style of Judo... it was just a regional preference for NeWaza... a loophole that allowed smaller guys to compete against bigger guys.

    Don't forget for once that Judo is political... very very political with strategic rule changes that always seem to benefit the makers of the rules.

  2. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    I'm with the mainstream Judo-ers that believe that modern Kosen is- well- a myth. It's true that the old school Kosen players in Japan were accomplished at newaza and were able to thus nullify their size handicap against the big Tokyo guys, but the Kodokan or should I say, Tokyo Judo Clubs took care of that with one of their famous rule changes "for the good of Judo". There is no Kosen style of Judo... it was just a regional preference for NeWaza... a loophole that allowed smaller guys to compete against bigger guys.

    Don't forget for once that Judo is political... very very political with strategic rule changes that always seem to benefit the makers of the rules.
    Yeah, the politics at high level competition is just disgusting. I imagine it is this way for most competitive sports, though.
    It is better to have less thunder in the mouth and more lightning in the hand. - Apache Proverb

  3. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by JamesC View Post
    Yeah, the politics at high level competition is just disgusting. I imagine it is this way for most competitive sports, though.
    I just spent the last 3 months having to learn the Greco Roman no leg grabbing version of Kata Guruma because of a recent rule change for the betterment of Judo.

    Some of us have spent literally years developing our personal favorite throws only to have them taken from us because some people with political pull couldn't stand losing. I was soooooo peaved that I nearly dropped Judo all together. Still mad when I think about it.

  4. #94
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    so what do you guys think about training judo just for self defense?
    For whoso comes amongst many shall one day find that no one man is by so far the mightiest of all.

  5. #95
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    It is fantastic. Your techniques are pressure tested as you learn them. Doesn't get much better for learning throws, imo.

    It's really the competition stuff that takes the most hits from all the politics. I remember there were a bunch of rule changes just before my first competition too, but I was so new that it wasn't a big deal to me.

    There were a few people from the US Olympic team there. It was amazing how well they could throw.
    It is better to have less thunder in the mouth and more lightning in the hand. - Apache Proverb

  6. #96
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    cool, i mainly want to learn judo just for my own personal martial arts. i really like the advice ykw gives about mapping my throws to no gi. i am going to do that.
    Last edited by Lucas; 07-08-2011 at 03:00 PM.
    For whoso comes amongst many shall one day find that no one man is by so far the mightiest of all.

  7. #97
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    The 三角肌deltoid is the strongest muscle on human body. Try to use it for landing.

    http://translate.google.com/translat...%26prmd%3Divns

  8. #98

    Lucas

    This will sound crazy, but Judo made me good at kung fu. Judo is rough- especially if you're competitive and have a good group of guys to practice with. It will be frustrating for you at first because you'll be new, and you may feel weak when you compare yourself with guys about your age with the same amount of martial experience (just in Judo) and you go to play randori with them.

    It'll be frustrating - but, after you give it some time, you'll get better. You'll notice how the stuff that you learned "blends" with the stuff you'll be learning, much like how SC blends strikes and throws - you'll just have to make the connection yourself. And then you'll start winning some... and then it evens out to where you're 50/50 in your club. Then you start beating people in other clubs... then one day you'll realize that you're strong in Judo. And you'll realize that you've been in literally hundreds of "fights" with skilled martial artists- then you start to see things differently. Your confidence is at a level that TCMA by itself might not have given you because of the lack of consistent hard randori... but you have it now. Then the fight club thing happens- where you're subconciously sizing people up everywhere you go- where you can walk into a club and spot the one or two people who may give you a problem if you had to fight them, and you'll definitely spot the phonies - the bullies that think they're strong just by virtue of being big. It's a whole new world- and you'll see it the way a fighting martial artists sees it.

  9. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    I'm with the mainstream Judo-ers that believe that modern Kosen is- well- a myth. It's true that the old school Kosen players in Japan were accomplished at newaza and were able to thus nullify their size handicap against the big Tokyo guys, but the Kodokan or should I say, Tokyo Judo Clubs took care of that with one of their famous rule changes "for the good of Judo". There is no Kosen style of Judo... it was just a regional preference for NeWaza... a loophole that allowed smaller guys to compete against bigger guys.

    Don't forget for once that Judo is political... very very political with strategic rule changes that always seem to benefit the makers of the rules.
    Myth maybe ( probably) but the old -pre-war judo did tend to be far more grappling oriented than the olympic judo.
    There is a Kosen dojo in Japan though, or at least there was.
    There are also a few "combat judo" one which are, basically, MMA with a gi.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    This will sound crazy, but Judo made me good at kung fu. Judo is rough- especially if you're competitive and have a good group of guys to practice with. It will be frustrating for you at first because you'll be new, and you may feel weak when you compare yourself with guys about your age with the same amount of martial experience (just in Judo) and you go to play randori with them.

    It'll be frustrating - but, after you give it some time, you'll get better. You'll notice how the stuff that you learned "blends" with the stuff you'll be learning, much like how SC blends strikes and throws - you'll just have to make the connection yourself. And then you'll start winning some... and then it evens out to where you're 50/50 in your club. Then you start beating people in other clubs... then one day you'll realize that you're strong in Judo. And you'll realize that you've been in literally hundreds of "fights" with skilled martial artists- then you start to see things differently. Your confidence is at a level that TCMA by itself might not have given you because of the lack of consistent hard randori... but you have it now. Then the fight club thing happens- where you're subconciously sizing people up everywhere you go- where you can walk into a club and spot the one or two people who may give you a problem if you had to fight them, and you'll definitely spot the phonies - the bullies that think they're strong just by virtue of being big. It's a whole new world- and you'll see it the way a fighting martial artists sees it.
    Well put sir, two thumbs up.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    I'm with the mainstream Judo-ers that believe that modern Kosen is- well- a myth. It's true that the old school Kosen players in Japan were accomplished at newaza and were able to thus nullify their size handicap against the big Tokyo guys, but the Kodokan or should I say, Tokyo Judo Clubs took care of that with one of their famous rule changes "for the good of Judo". There is no Kosen style of Judo... it was just a regional preference for NeWaza... a loophole that allowed smaller guys to compete against bigger guys.

    Don't forget for once that Judo is political... very very political with strategic rule changes that always seem to benefit the makers of the rules.
    I only studied Judo for a short time, but had heard that in class. Competition rules were changed since many Judoka were losing to wrestlers who knew single/double leg takedowns and didn't really "know judo" other than their wrestling background.

    I have also heard that the Russians at one time had a very stylized version with a unique grip that gave them an advantage in competition and then the rules were changed so the grip couldn't be used.

    Don't know how true either of those are, but that was the info passed onto me.

    PS: The Judo club that I did go to spent their time 50/50. They met two times a week and Day 1 was all stand up and throwing and Day 2 of the week was spent on ground fighting. They also met on another day for free sparring. It was a great place, too bad gas was so high to keep going.
    "God gave you a brain, and it annoys Him greatly when you choose not to use it."

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin73 View Post
    I only studied Judo for a short time, but had heard that in class. Competition rules were changed since many Judoka were losing to wrestlers who knew single/double leg takedowns and didn't really "know judo" other than their wrestling background.

    I have also heard that the Russians at one time had a very stylized version with a unique grip that gave them an advantage in competition and then the rules were changed so the grip couldn't be used.

    Don't know how true either of those are, but that was the info passed onto me.

    PS: The Judo club that I did go to spent their time 50/50. They met two times a week and Day 1 was all stand up and throwing and Day 2 of the week was spent on ground fighting. They also met on another day for free sparring. It was a great place, too bad gas was so high to keep going.
    Judo is very political, more than TKD is you can believe that.
    Olympic events are ALL VERY political.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  13. #103
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    is it hard to avoid the politics? in your guys' experience is the training any different if you train for self defense rather than sport?
    For whoso comes amongst many shall one day find that no one man is by so far the mightiest of all.

  14. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucas View Post
    is it hard to avoid the politics? in your guys' experience is the training any different if you train for self defense rather than sport?
    Yes you can avoid the politics and yes the training will be different- IMO though - it's more fun to train in the competitive classes than in the "traditional" classes (they work out harder). When you join Judo - you're joining an organization. So it's not like you have to stay in any one place. You're usually free to roam from club to club and it's encouraged (you will of course have a "home base" that you'll refer to as your club). Anyway - you'll find what you need and there's never any requirement that you participate in competitions.

  15. #105
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    sweet news. im excited. im moving this week so im not going to be starting for a couple weeks, once everything is settled and situated. from the photo gallery on line the group looks like a fun bunch of people so that is aplus.
    For whoso comes amongst many shall one day find that no one man is by so far the mightiest of all.

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