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Thread: Is Gongfu Dead???

  1. #31
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    If kung fu was dead, we wouldn't have a new thread with this title every few months for the last five years.
    Think kung fu is dead? Check out Hollywood.

  2. #32
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    Hmmm...Actually this discussion's been going on a lot longer than that. Since MMA...since Bruce Lee's death...since cultural revolution....since boxer rebellion...since.... what can you infer from this?

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    sorry if i sounded stupid i don't think i've been unfortunate enough to meet a traditionalist so far
    Actually, I quoted it because I thought it was a good post...
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    IMO, the best way to save TCMA is to send students to the MMA gyms.
    I agree and I would take it one step further. I would suggest the best way to teach a new student TCMA is to teach them with MMA or Sanda style training for the first year...so they are strong and capable of fighting. Then start introducing the esoteric exercises...they will understand better and be better able to apply.

    I think the reason there is so much resistance to this is only partly tradition. It's partly the sifu's fear of being incompetent in such an environment and partly the fear of losing students who don't have the desire or heart for hard training.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post
    Kung fu died a long time ago. It was killed by the invention of forms.
    I refer you to my current signature...

    Originally Posted by SoCo KungFu
    MMA didn't kill kung fu, just stole its girlfriend. Kung fu committed suicide in a Denny's parking lot
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  6. #36
    Is kung fu dead? If your referring to it's popularity then just wait for that one good unique kung fu movie that appeals to the mass and it will resurge again. Like what the Ip Man movies did for Wing Chun. And what Bruce Lee and Jackie Chan did during their times. It's lame, but unfortunately true.

  7. #37
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    What do you think that a 70 years old boxer, MT guy, Judo guy, BJJ guy would "train at home alone when sparring/wrestling is not available"?

    A

    - boxer may train jab, cross, hook, uppercut combo as shadow boxing.
    - MT guy may train roundhouse kick, jab, cross, elbow, clinch, knee strike combo solo drill.
    - Judo guy may train hip throw, inner hook, outer hook combo solo drill.
    - BJJ guy may ...

    Whether you want to call it shadow boxing or form, I don't see much different there. We don't have training partner 24/7. How to train solo at home should have no difference between styles.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 11-09-2013 at 10:22 AM.
    http://johnswang.com

    More opinion -> more argument
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  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by LaRoux View Post
    The main difference is that the Judokas, BJJ'ers, boxers, wrestlers, and MT practitioners are making their "forms" up on the fly based on their past experiences with applying techniques against opponents.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by ShaolinDan View Post
    Hmmm...Actually this discussion's been going on a lot longer than that. Since MMA...since Bruce Lee's death...since cultural revolution....since boxer rebellion...since.... what can you infer from this?
    the more history you read, the more you should be aware of some reoccurring issues in CMA that have been going on thousands of years...

    that being said, I think we are in a new era... in the past there were those raging against the problems and trying to keep CMA pure and combat effective. IN today's age, who really cares about "combat effective"? Certainly we have tournaments, and health, and contemporary wushu and movies, etc

    And those seeking combat effectiveness have MMA...

    There ARE difference with today's situation
    Chan Tai San Book at https://www.createspace.com/4891253

    Quote Originally Posted by taai gihk yahn View Post
    well, like LKFMDC - he's a genuine Kung Fu Hero™
    Quote Originally Posted by Taixuquan99 View Post
    As much as I get annoyed when it gets derailed by the array of strange angry people that hover around him like moths, his good posts are some of my favorites.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    I think he goes into a cave to meditate and recharge his chi...and bite the heads off of bats, of course....

  10. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by lkfmdc View Post
    I think we are in a new era... in the past there were those raging against the problems and trying to keep CMA pure and combat effective. IN today's age, who really cares about "combat effective"?
    I could probably name a dozen regular posters here who care about that...
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  11. #41
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    If you want "combat effectiveness" get a GUN! You don't need bjj, mma or kung fu. Empty hand fighting has ALWAYS been the last resort for self-defense.

    Kung fu stands on its own and will survive because it has many things to offer the practitioner from cradle to grave. Combat effectiveness is only one aspect of kung fu's value.
    Richard A. Tolson
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    There are two types of Chinese martial artists. Those who can fight and those who should be teaching dance or yoga!

    53 years of training, 43 years of teaching and still aiming for perfection!

    Recovering Forms Junkie! Even my twelve step program has four roads!

  12. #42
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    Why do we need (combo) form?

    Let's look at this from the angle of the throwing art. If all you care about is "single leg" or "double legs", when you fail, you will try it again. If you always stay on the "single move" level, you just keep trying to use the same move over and over, the combo (or form) will have no value to you.

    When you use one move to throw your opponent, if he escapes or still remains balance, you will need to use another move to throw him. This is called "combo". Since not all move will have logical connection to another move, there are combo that are worthwhile to be recorded and be passed down from generation to generation.

    The following clip shows 2 combos that you can use to attack your opponent "on the same direction". The

    - 1st combo is when you apply "hip throw" and your opponent escapes, you can use "leg block" to throw him.
    - 2nd combo is when you apply "front cut", your opponent escapes, you can use "sickle hook" to throw him.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngH80X-3t8g

    If a teacher didn't teach his students these combo, will his students be able to figure it out by themselves? May be or may be not. If you record these kind of combo into a "form", it can help the study of the future generation and save them a lot of time trying to figure it out all by themselves.
    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 11-09-2013 at 06:54 PM.
    http://johnswang.com

    More opinion -> more argument
    Less opinion -> less argument
    No opinion -> no argument

  13. #43
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  14. #44
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    Stupid lies, posturing and putting forth of something as something it is not deserves to die.

    But Kung Fu? Kung fu can't die. It just has to be picked up and worked towards by one person, any person.

    If it is the whole of your identity, you might have issues...

    If it is integrated into your lifestyle, you've done well.
    Kung Fu is good for you.

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    - goes to shanghai looking for kung fu
    - comes back saying kung fu is dead
    Just saying, there is some good kung fu to be found easily in Shanghai, as pretty much everywhere else in China if you know where to look.

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