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Thread: I think Judo is going to overtake BJJ as the grappling art of choice for MMA

  1. #121
    Quote Originally Posted by sanjuro_ronin View Post
    Rhonda has no one at here level yet.
    I mean, the girl is Elite.
    She is simply far better than anyone else right now.
    I have always said and probably always will say that a fighter with a solid base in a TMA ( Like Judo) and well trained in MMA will always have a better chance in MMA than one that is 100% MMA trained.
    Honda's level is changing more than her competitors too. 2 yrs ago a Cyborg match was not a good idea. Now it is. Her striking has come up 300%.

    On the fighter's base, I'm at a tossup. I definitely think mastering one art like judo to a very deep level first, then expanding is one way I've seen work very effectively. Lately elite wrestlers who can build a certain skill level striking are winning. But I am also seeing very young kids coming up simulataneously in multiple disciplines under a good mma coach and doing very well. An example of the first category to me is Cain Velasquez. An example of the second category would be Jon Jones.

  2. #122
    Rousey is a heart breaker!!
    One of my sparring partners is a freestyle Judoka. I love practicing shuai chiao against him cause i HAVE to get a clean throw or else. We go jacketless only and he is still very skilled.

    Freestyle wrestling is a pretty well rounded grappling art too, but when your life's training is to put the guy on his back after throwing him, it plays right into the hands of a bjj guy. I think coaching a guy to slam and get back up immediately would yield better results for wrestlers in mma than trying to pick up bjj also.

    All good freestyle guys should know all of these:
    (I don't like the titles in the film though)

    --—••—--•--—••—–-
    Its only a problem if there is a solution
    ⚓️

  3. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayfaring View Post
    Beast. I still do not see any way he could have that level of mobility with that toe. He had better footwork with that toe than 90% of that division healthy.
    i felt he channeled Genki Sudo at one point or Anderson Silva... he looked like he was doing the robot like Genki lol

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Wayfaring View Post
    Honda's level is changing more than her competitors too. 2 yrs ago a Cyborg match was not a good idea. Now it is. Her striking has come up 300%.

    On the fighter's base, I'm at a tossup. I definitely think mastering one art like judo to a very deep level first, then expanding is one way I've seen work very effectively. Lately elite wrestlers who can build a certain skill level striking are winning. But I am also seeing very young kids coming up simulataneously in multiple disciplines under a good mma coach and doing very well. An example of the first category to me is Cain Velasquez. An example of the second category would be Jon Jones.
    i think key is the training, not to compartmentalize each of the styles/arts and keep them segregated... should train it as a whole... as mma... witness the bjj only who couldn't adapt to mma rules ... getting hit while pulling guard and getting stacked and gnp ... which is not within bjj rules

  5. #125
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    if I had to choose to pay to watch either bjj or judo strictly for entertainment value...judo hands down. The vast majority of mma audience do not seriously train either art and are watching to be entertained
    Last edited by Lucas; 07-08-2014 at 05:16 PM. Reason: if I had to choose to pay to watch either bjj or judo strictly for entertainment value...judo hands down. The vast majority o
    For whoso comes amongst many shall one day find that no one man is by so far the mightiest of all.

  6. #126
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    What was the name of the throw that Rousey did to Davis?

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by RickMatz View Post
    What was the name of the throw that Rousey did to Davis?
    modified hara goshi i think, using head control rather than the gi

  8. #128
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wayfaring View Post
    Honda's level is changing more than her competitors too. 2 yrs ago a Cyborg match was not a good idea. Now it is. Her striking has come up 300%.

    On the fighter's base, I'm at a tossup. I definitely think mastering one art like judo to a very deep level first, then expanding is one way I've seen work very effectively. Lately elite wrestlers who can build a certain skill level striking are winning. But I am also seeing very young kids coming up simulataneously in multiple disciplines under a good mma coach and doing very well. An example of the first category to me is Cain Velasquez. An example of the second category would be Jon Jones.
    Didn’t Jones wrestle to a high level in college?
    I think the issue isnt so much having a deep understanding of a single art first before moving to mastering others v being an MMA athlete from the start as much as it is if you are a world class athlete in America or Europe you will probably go down mastering the signle art first route simply because because that’s what is done in schools, or gets you a college or uni scholarship (with wrestling or judo) or is the art geared towards allowing you to safely compete at all levels in striking with a chance on fighting internationally and professionally (in terms of boxing and thai when it comes to striking)
    No a lot of good MMA gyms allow kids straight into their programme, and the best fighters are always the ones who start young,

    Ronda is an example of what a world class athlete can do if she puts her mind to it and changes disciplines early enough: the athlete skill, timing, physical attributes and ability to learn which made her a world class judoka have now simply been turned to making her a world class striker
    I think she will retire soon though and move into movies getting paid $120 to fight is nothing really, and only half of that is guaranteed the rest was a win bonus she could make that for a 10 min appearance in the next fast and furious movie lol

    Ronda Rousey*($60,000 + $60,000 = $120,000

  9. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pipefighter View Post
    Rousey is a heart breaker!!
    One of my sparring partners is a freestyle Judoka. I love practicing shuai chiao against him cause i HAVE to get a clean throw or else. We go jacketless only and he is still very skilled.

    Freestyle wrestling is a pretty well rounded grappling art too, but when your life's training is to put the guy on his back after throwing him, it plays right into the hands of a bjj guy. I think coaching a guy to slam and get back up immediately would yield better results for wrestlers in mma than trying to pick up bjj also.

    All good freestyle guys should know all of these:
    (I don't like the titles in the film though)

    They don’t need to pick up BJJ though, all they need to do is pick up enough submission defense to stay safe in the guard whilst they ground and pound (which a lot of them get good at very quickly because tey understand how to control their opponents hips which is the key to killing the guard) just as the Thai and BJJ guys like aldo don’t bother learning proper freestyle wrestling they simply learn enough to be able to defend the common takedowns and impose their game on their opponent

  10. #130
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    If a wrestler can learn just enough sub. defense then he can ride all day on top and GNP. BJJ is good for learning subs and having a fighting chance from the back, but wrestling is the king of domination and movement while on the ground. Domination of holding a person in place and being able to move them or themselves to the spot they wish. Not saying a wrestler can't get caught, especially from someone with more experience, but a BJJ saying that holds true for a wrestler "Position to submission," and wrestling is about position.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i had an old taichi lady talk smack behind my back. i mean comon man, come on. if it was 200 years ago,, mebbe i wouldve smacked her and took all her monehs.
    Originally posted by Bawang
    i am manly and strong. do not insult me cracker.

  11. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by MightyB View Post
    Because the game seems to be played differently nowadays, I think Judo is going to overtake BJJ as the grappling art of choice for MMA.

    Check this video out to see what I mean.
    Didnt Kimura beat one of the Gracies a long time ago?

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by trubblman View Post
    Didnt Kimura beat one of the Gracies a long time ago?
    He beat helio, what does that prove or mean though?

  13. #133
    Quote Originally Posted by Frost View Post
    They don’t need to pick up BJJ though, all they need to do is pick up enough submission defense to stay safe in the guard whilst they ground and pound (which a lot of them get good at very quickly because tey understand how to control their opponents hips which is the key to killing the guard) just as the Thai and BJJ guys like aldo don’t bother learning proper freestyle wrestling they simply learn enough to be able to defend the common takedowns and impose their game on their opponent
    I used to totally agree. I thought the best place for me is tight inside the guard stacking em, keeping their hips from slipping out into a leg lock, GNP. I agree every wrestler should know the defenses for a triangle, guillotine, and arm bar. I think other sub defense is mostly second nature to a good wrestler.
    Over the last few years my opinion has changed. It takes a lot of energy to be top dominant in a fight or wrestling match. It takes a lot less energy to slam, throw a few blows with minimal body contact, then let them struggle back up while you rest and hover around them with strikes. Even being top dominant and fighting for position is still half playing their game. I feel that is a coaching issue, but it's hard to change old habits

    To be honest, i am half joking about wrestling being the premier grappling art of the UFC. Judo goes along with the rule set much better. Wrestlers have often won in spite of the rules. Headbutt's would change the game completely for the wrestler.
    Last edited by Pipefighter; 07-11-2014 at 08:51 AM.
    --—••—--•--—••—–-
    Its only a problem if there is a solution
    ⚓️

  14. #134
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    MMA has always been about becoming proficient in a solid base skill set ( grappling, striking, ground fighting, whatever) and learning enough of the rest to counter it and impose YOUR skill set.
    People learned very quickly that if they have been striking for 10 years that no amount of grappling training was going to allow them to beat a grappler that had been grappling for 10 years at his own game, it's just not gonna happen.
    What they did find out is that they could learn enough to do enough to keep the fight in the conditions that favoured THEIR skill set.
    Psalms 144:1
    Praise be my Lord my Rock,
    He trains my hands for war, my fingers for battle !

  15. #135
    Just another example of how awesome Rousey is when she's using Judo



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