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Thread: Iron Hand Against Grapplers

  1. #16
    wiz cool c,

    Sad to hear about your knee.

    If you feel the need to do Iron Palm as a part of your training arsenal, do it. But understand something: in a real situation you will not know what your opponent knows. So it pays to be well rounded. Case in point: there were some MA retailers in NYC that trained in a branch of Southern Shaolin. When Gracie Jiu Jitsu hit the scene, they were not trashing it at all. They were intrigued enough to look at it, even if just from a book, to assess its strengths and weaknesses. And they were really pushing the books from that perspective. I respected them for that.

    mickey

  2. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by mickey View Post
    wiz cool c,

    Sad to hear about your knee.

    If you feel the need to do Iron Palm as a part of your training arsenal, do it. But understand something: in a real situation you will not know what your opponent knows. So it pays to be well rounded. Case in point: there were some MA retailers in NYC that trained in a branch of Southern Shaolin. When Gracie Jiu Jitsu hit the scene, they were not trashing it at all. They were intrigued enough to look at it, even if just from a book, to assess its strengths and weaknesses. And they were really pushing the books from that perspective. I respected them for that.

    mickey
    As I had mentioned twice here already I have competed in judo and jujutsu competetions before,as well as having trained in sombo as well, you have competed in grappling competitions before yourself? And yes I train in iron hand training cause I am a kung fu practitioner, as well as having done shuai jiao/MMA under Yao Honggang,ever heard of him? His brother fights in the UFC now and Yao is a pro MMA fighter from china with many pro fights under his belt as well as being a shuai jiao master and champion and a purple belt in BJJ
    Last edited by wiz cool c; 10-02-2015 at 03:22 PM.

  3. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by bawang View Post
    lol @ defending takedown with horse stance
    Horse stance is very useful in stuffing takedowns. You don't need to sprawl if you catch him before he gets deep.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    This is 100% TCMA principle. It may be used in non-TCMA also. Since I did learn it from TCMA, I have to say it's TCMA principle.
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    We should not use "TCMA is more than combat" as excuse for not "evolving".

    You can have Kung Fu in cooking, it really has nothing to do with fighting!

  4. #19
    OoooKay,

    You are talking about sport competition. I am out of this thread.


    mickey

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiz cool c View Post
    I think a major problem here is people are quick to throw away or lose faith in their system, ...
    Agree! A valid solution is a valid solution. It doesn't matter whether it's CMA solution or MMA solution.

    When your opponent shoots at your leg, if you can put your hands behind his neck, redirect him to the ground, and let him to kiss dirt, you should be able to strike your hand on the back of his head. A strike on the back of your opponent's head is a very good "finish move".

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    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 10-02-2015 at 05:07 PM.
    http://johnswang.com

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  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Agree! A valid solution is a valid solution. It doesn't matter whether it's CMA solution or MMA solution.

    When your opponent shoots at your leg, if you can put your hands behind his neck and let him to kiss dirt, you should be able to strike your hand on the back of his head. A strike on the back of your opponent's head is a very good "finish move".

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    Interesting John, have been thinking of this one in my head as well, slapping a guy in the back of the head or neck with IP strike. I learned something like this back in my ninjutsu days, but recently realized the Iron hand training makes your slaps very heavy when i slapped a mosquito on the back of my neck.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by wiz cool c View Post
    Interesting John, have been thinking of this one in my head as well, slapping a guy in the back of the head or neck with IP strike. I learned something like this back in my ninjutsu days, but recently realized the Iron hand training makes your slaps very heavy when i slapped a mosquito on the back of my neck.
    Instead of using both of your hands to push down on your opponent's back neck, if you just use one hand to push and another hand to do "willow palm" strike, even if you may not be able to knock your opponent out, you can still make him to "kiss the dirt".
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    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 10-02-2015 at 05:13 PM.
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  8. #23
    interesting, in the ninjutsu version we did a double handed slap downward on the base of the skull can honestly say i have not tried that technique in competition nor a real fight though. in the Beijing Shaui Jiao we did single leg takedown attempt defense by hooking one leg inside the attackers leg pushing down on the back of his neck and grabbing his leg with the other hand and dumping him over. i vaguely remember the hung gar instructor demonstrating a single hand downward slap while stepping back in a front stance[i know hung gar people train IP so fair to say it is a IP technique. is there a strike in that sequence above Jonh? cant tell
    Last edited by wiz cool c; 10-02-2015 at 05:20 PM.

  9. #24
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    To strike on the back of your opponent's head is a very important CMA skill. The "抹(Mo) - Wiping" that you use your hand to pull your opponent's back neck toward you can be replaced by a "willow palm" strike on the back of the head. So IP can be used by a grappler on a striker as well.

    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 10-02-2015 at 07:17 PM.
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  10. #25
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    Here is another example of "抹(Mo) - Wiping". If you can do this, you can use your IP to strike on the back of your opponent's head.

    Last edited by YouKnowWho; 10-02-2015 at 07:28 PM.
    http://johnswang.com

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  11. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    Horse stance is very useful in stuffing takedowns. You don't need to sprawl if you catch him before he gets deep.
    lol
    hkjhkh

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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    A strike on the back of your opponent's head is a very good "finish move".
    Side of head requires less force against force and is easier to cause hemorrhage.

  13. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Kellen Bassette View Post
    Horse stance is very useful in stuffing takedowns. You don't need to sprawl if you catch him before he gets deep.
    Check that Silva article I posted earlier and it describes the process of why this statement is true and how you can use a wide stance to shut down takedown attempts.

  14. #29
    Great stuff John. Thank you.

    GuyB. Thanks for the link. Sometimes we "read" horse-stance and we see static position with an upright body practicing reverse punches. A still picture. ( Other's may see a side stance application if it) Peoples mind work that way. They forget their can be movement in that stance. Wrestling stance. Basically a moving horse stance. Some guys stager. Some guys more square.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Wji1jm_kEM

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by YouKnowWho View Post
    Instead of using both of your hands to push down on your opponent's back neck, if you just use one hand to push and another hand to do "willow palm" strike, even if you may not be able to knock your opponent out, you can still make him to "kiss the dirt".
    Umm no one shoots like that with there legs back back bent and arms reaching, it only works if your partner has no idea about grappling or cant put there knee down on the shot, heck even on a high shot your knee penetrates between there's so making them eat dirt next to useless

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