the problem with forms

[Scott R. Brown]

I agree.

In our society we tend to think too much about winning in a competition. I understand that is the overall purpose however, to me competition should be about challenging us to improve.

I haven't competed in many years. In my younger days I was a State class swimmer. If I won a race, but did not improve my time, it was the same as a loss in my mind. If I lost a race, but improved my time, it was the same as a win in my mind. My purpose was to improve myself and one well established manner to stimulate improvement is to be tested. For fighting that means actually fighting.

Being challenged reinforces our strengths and hopefully reveals to us our weaknesses. We commonly learn more from our mistakes than our successes.

[Becca]

crowds bug me, what can I say. I'm not afraid of loosing, as this is a big part of improoving. but i don't even like going to malls because of the crowds. haven't been to a concert since i was in jr. high. always sit in the nose bleed section at events... I like the looks of this turny, though, because i don't think there will too big of a crowd on mother's day weekend.

[SifuAbel]

and I've said many times that I wasted a huge amount of time with many things associated with "tradition" and swore I'd never waste my students' time with it.....

So don't try and drag me onto "your side"

Pft, you wouldn't be who you are today without them.

[SifuAbel]

What exactly would there to be afraid of? That you might lose? My sifu was a feared and respected fighter,

Thank God he only wasted part of his time on Kung fu training, right?

[golden arhat]

I

Chuck Norris was just a standup fighter (and at one time a point fighter) so since he isn't MMA I guess Golden Arhat can take him easily.

if i'm honest and this is all CN jokes aside. i think most grapplers would be able to tie CN up if they wanted to, well anyone with a measure of skill anyway he doesnt train in wrestling or jiu jutsu does he? so sure i'd probably get hurt but i've probably faced better people than him.its not like there is a shortage.

[golden arhat]

Pft, you wouldn't be who you are today without them.

nope he wouldnt

he'd probably be better.

[sanjuro_ronin]

if i'm honest and this is all CN jokes aside. i think most grapplers would be able to tie CN up if they wanted to, well anyone with a measure of skill anyway he doesnt train in wrestling or jiu jutsu does he? so sure i'd probably get hurt but i've probably faced better people than him.its not like there is a shortage.

Chuck is high ranking BJJ under the Machados, he may be a black belt actually.

[KFNOOB]

I thnk its great that guys here with great experience give honest views on the TCMA. Its interesting to see how those with knowledge and no agenda can give their views on forms, sparring etc. This is incredibly valuable to us newbies because it can really help us pinpoint an art/style with realistic expectations and avoid wasting years in something we thought was different.
Thanks.

[David Jamieson]

if i'm honest and this is all CN jokes aside. i think most grapplers would be able to tie CN up if they wanted to, well anyone with a measure of skill anyway he doesnt train in wrestling or jiu jutsu does he? so sure i'd probably get hurt but i've probably faced better people than him.its not like there is a shortage.

It's not that it's bad to think. It's good to think. But making incorrect suppositions based on that thinking should lead one to perhaps think some more. Mostly about how they so easily draw conclusions when all they have is their own thought to base it on. :-)

[David Jamieson]

In the end. I would say the only real problem with forms is that there are so many. lol

I personally think that one could take a curriculum of forms and use only that as the library of techniques infused with gongs for the partial method for development as a kungfu person.

But then, all the stylistic differences would be lost an various histories, like rare languages would be lost. they are worth keeping afterall...seeing as they are art.

the only forms that are useless are the ones that are made up out of ego, contain little in the way of aspplicable material and are fraudulent. These are hard to pick out, though I would say, not so much when it comes to actually testing the material. It will either work for the person, or it will fail for them.

[Yao Sing]

Point fighting is a game, it is not a fight. Having said that just because one plays tag does not mean they can't fight, but neither does it automatically mean they can fight.

And that right there was my point. I really hate being in the position of depending point fighters but there no reason a point fighter can't be a baz street fighter. Of course realistically nowadays he probably would have migrated to MMA. But it's not all that long ago the these venues weren't available.

Someone like Arhat doesn't know there was MA life before MMA.

i think most grapplers would be able to tie CN up if they wanted to, well anyone with a measure of skill anyway he doesnt train in wrestling or jiu jutsu does he? so sure i'd probably get hurt but i've probably faced better people than him.its not like there is a shortage.

You've faced better fighters than Chuck Norris? Name some names, please.

I'm not exactly a big fan of Norris but that statement is pure fantasy land.

[sanjuro_ronin]

I think that, the main issue with forms is not wither they are useful, but what they are used for.
In a group environment, they are fine for teaching basics and "passing the time" and getting some exercise, all at once.
You don't need them to fight, you don't need them for exercise, but they do serve a function.
I think that most people do them because they like them, they are fun, certainly less telling on the body than doing sparring all the time or equipment work.
They can be used as a "measuring stick, for ones knowledge of a system, though I don't really think that is a good way.
I dropped many of the forms I know, keeping only a selected few, not because they are "fighting practical", but because they build certain attributes and I like doing them.
Would I ever teach them to anyone?
Sure, for the same reason I do them.

[lkfmdc]

Pft, you wouldn't be who you are today without them.

you are correct, I would be BETTER

[lkfmdc]

Chuck is high ranking BJJ under the Machados, he may be a black belt actually.

black belt in BJJ under machados

also integrated boxing into his tang soo do as far back as early 70's

also has a judo background

and. of course, his tears cure cancer

[sanjuro_ronin]

black belt in BJJ under machados

also integrated boxing into his tang soo do as far back as early 70's

also has a judo background

and. of course, his tears cure cancer

And that hidden 3rd fist in his beard, don't forget that.